Genealogy

in reality, all of this has been a total load of old bollocks
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The Fish
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Genealogy

Postby The Fish » 23 Nov 2021, 18:49

Has anyone done this?

Seems more popular with everyone watching Who Do You Think You Are ? and more available to do for yourself with the advent of internet sites like Ancestry and Find My Past etc

Anyway with time on my hands now, I took a 6 month subscription to Ancestry to see what I could find. Initially just filling in the names and dates for previous generations, which among other things threw up 4 successive generations all called Jeremiah Silver and each one of them married a Mary.
Also discovered the SIlvers were nearly all born, married and died in Spitalfields, Shoreditch and Bethnal Green, so I is proper cockney innit.

I suppose the holy grail though is to find someone famous which barring direct line is somethng of a needle in a haystack unless you know what you are looking for. I did however strike lucky. A great-grandmother's maiden name was BISH, which going back generations bcame BYSH and then BYSSHE, which was the hmm I wonder moment. I' knew the poet Shelley's middle name was Bysshe but never gave thought to it being so unusual that it had to be a family name of sorts. So I perservered going back generations to find a common ancestor and eventually found one, Sir John Bysshe (1520 - 1582), so my 12 times great-grandparents were Shelley's 6 times great-grandparents.So there you are. I'm related to Percy Shelley.

Any stories of note from your ancestry?
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souphound
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Re: Genealogy

Postby souphound » 23 Nov 2021, 19:03

That sounds like a lot of fun indeed. I just might look into that, for a laugh.
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Positive Passion
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Re: Genealogy

Postby Positive Passion » 24 Nov 2021, 07:29

The Fish wrote: so I is proper cockney innit.


Clearly not if you think cockneys talk like that, me old china.

My son did a thing where you find out your genetic make-up, so not quite same - turns out he (the cockney-born child of parents from the US and Australia) has mainly Scots, Irish and German genes with a decent slug of Viking - but apparently nearly everyone in Europe has a decent slug of Viking.

The Mayflower 400 exhibit in Plymouth has a section on famous descendants from Mayflower voyagers. Taylor Swift has something like 6 Mayflower voyagers among her ancestors.

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Re: Genealogy

Postby Rorschach » 24 Nov 2021, 07:55

We're all descendants of Charlemagne.

In Europe, our most common recent ancestor lived about 600 years ago and, if you go back 1,000 years, all Europeans are descended from every single person (whose line didn't go extinct) who was alive at that time.

I reckon you'll find lots more famous people you're connected to, if you keep poking around.
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Re: Genealogy

Postby GoogaMooga » 24 Nov 2021, 08:00

I know of one great-great grandfather who was a blacksmith from Sweden. He emigrated to America, but died soon after arriving and is buried in Arlington.
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Re: Genealogy

Postby Tom Waits For No One » 24 Nov 2021, 08:08

My uncle has spent some time tracing my mam's side of the family tree, going back around 400 years.
A long line of saddlers from Scotland and some convergence with Charles de Gaulle's lineage.
Which is nice.
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Re: Genealogy

Postby Positive Passion » 24 Nov 2021, 08:13

Rorschach wrote:.

In Europe, our most common recent ancestor lived about 600 years ago and, if you go back 1,000 years, all Europeans are descended from every single person (whose line didn't go extinct) who was alive at that time.


I suppose that is logical; 1000 years is 30-plus generations, and 2 to the power of 30 is over a billion. [They might say this in the article - I didn't read it because of all the pop-ups]

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Re: Genealogy

Postby Rorschach » 24 Nov 2021, 08:31

Positive Passion wrote:
Rorschach wrote:.

In Europe, our most common recent ancestor lived about 600 years ago and, if you go back 1,000 years, all Europeans are descended from every single person (whose line didn't go extinct) who was alive at that time.


I suppose that is logical; 1000 years is 30-plus generations, and 2 to the power of 30 is over a billion. [They might say this in the article - I didn't read it because of all the pop-ups]


The article does go into the maths though I can't remember the details exactly. The exponential number of ancestor gets pretty huge, pretty quickly, but the true number is much smaller because of cousins, second cousins, third cousins etc. having offspring together. As they all have common ancestors they get double counted if we just extrapolate out.

Obviously, I haven't verified any of this but it seems reasonable and tallies more or less with other Google headlines.
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Re: Genealogy

Postby Positive Passion » 24 Nov 2021, 08:40

Rorschach wrote:
Obviously, I haven't verified any of this


Obviously. I am totally with you though - all makes sense.

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Re: Genealogy

Postby Deebank » 24 Nov 2021, 09:31

My paternal grandmother’s maiden name was Shakespeare and she was from Kenilworth; a promising start to any genealogical search maybe.

Indeed my bro traced the line back to William Shakespeare’s grandfather. Will S had no surviving male heirs of course.


A few years ago my Mother in Law discovered That her father’s line were all Jewish. When we cleared out his house (years after he died, his second wife went into a sheltered home) We found copies of Mein Kampf, William The Dictator and Sparks’ first LP on his shelves. Coincidence?

Probably, but true nonetheless.
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The Fish
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Re: Genealogy

Postby The Fish » 24 Nov 2021, 11:33

Positive Passion wrote:
The Fish wrote: so I is proper cockney innit.


Clearly not if you think cockneys talk like that, me old china.



Clearly I don't and wasn't trying to convey that impression.

My initial aim when I started, before lucking out with the Shelley connection, was to investigate the fact that I have loads of Wellers from Surrey in current tree, and Mother's family are all Bucklers. Sadly no Foxtons to date. Nothing yet on that front.
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Positive Passion
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Re: Genealogy

Postby Positive Passion » 24 Nov 2021, 11:48

The Fish wrote:
Positive Passion wrote:
The Fish wrote: so I is proper cockney innit.


Clearly not if you think cockneys talk like that, me old china.



Clearly I don't and wasn't trying to convey that impression.



Smooth and rough, only a quarter.


My initial aim when I started, before lucking out with the Shelley connection, was to investigate the fact that I have loads of Wellers from Surrey in current tree, and Mother's family are all Bucklers. Sadly no Foxtons to date. Nothing yet on that front.


Still looking good though. Any Talbots , Lees or Whites?

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Re: Genealogy

Postby Deebank » 24 Nov 2021, 11:50

The Fish wrote:Also discovered the SIlvers were nearly all born, married and died in Spitalfields, Shoreditch and Bethnal Green, so I is proper cockney innit.


Silver? Bethnal Green? Like my wife's family sounds Jewish maybe.

You could change your name to The Gefilte Fish! :)
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Re: Genealogy

Postby Samoan » 24 Nov 2021, 12:11

Positive Passion wrote:...

My son did a thing where you find out your genetic make-up, so not quite same - turns out he (the cockney-born child of parents from the US and Australia) has mainly Scots, Irish and German genes with a decent slug of Viking - but apparently nearly everyone in Europe has a decent slug of Viking.

.....


My brother and sister-in-law did a two-for-one offer, just for larks, from a similar sounding organisation. He came out 50:50 Celtic:Scandanavian/Nordic so he reckons mine and my younger sister's will pan out roughly the same. Meanwhile herself, who prides herself on her indigenous Chilean Mapuche descent was raging to find out she was 1% English.
Nonsense to the aggressiveness, I've seen more aggression on the my little pony message board......I mean I was told.

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The Fish
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Re: Genealogy

Postby The Fish » 24 Nov 2021, 12:17

Positive Passion wrote:

Still looking good though. Any Talbots , Lees or Whites?


Not yet. Harder following links beyond what knowledge you have of immediate family, as online records only available readily for obvi0usly deceased, so latest census available, for example is 1911.

Of course success would mean that on the down side (some might say plus side) Yomp may never speak to me again :D
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Re: Genealogy

Postby Rayge » 25 Nov 2021, 10:06

I did this a couple of decades ago. It was fun. No-one famous, apart I'm sure from the power of two ancestors referred to in the Charlemagne thing. It was helped a good deal because my mother's mother's maiden name was unusual - Fryer-Kelsey, and when I googled it I found a keen genealogist of that ilk who sent me a family tree of the Fryer-Kelseys going back to the 18th century that stretched over about 15 sheets of A4 and showed that I had a hundred or more living relatives of various degrees of cousinage, not to mention a blizzard of dead ones. The most remarkable thing is virtually all of them were born and died in the South-East - very little geographical mobility.
All four of my grandparents were born in London, in economically deprived/working class areas - north-east London or Docklands.
The most interesting thing about the whole thing for me was that it personalized things I'd studied in social history - urbanisation, the associated killer diseases of 19th century cities, such as typhus, tuberculosis, cholera (my mothers father's parents, who lived in Jolly Sailor Row, Deptford, both died in their 20s), Imperial wars, World War I and so on.

I'm surprised Polishgirl hasn't leapt on this thread - she's very keen on this sort of thing
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Re: Genealogy

Postby Flower » 25 Nov 2021, 13:16

I recall starting a thread on this but can't find it.

My family changed its name from "K" to "B" while fleeing pogroms in the Ukraine (Russian Empire at the time). My dad always told me that the family knew the mayor of the town of "B" and took that as their last name for political reasons.

I would search from time to time for links between the names "K" and "B" but came up empty until the Summer of 2013 when I came across a website of a musician living in Denmark who stated that his family name was originally "K" but was changed to "B" .. he mentioned Brooklyn and sort of looked like one of my cousins but I didn't contact him until December. I gave him a bit of information about my family, including that my grandfather's brothers included a set of twins, the youngest brother's name, the name of one of my great Aunts and that my father's cousin "L" is a retired New York State Supreme Court Judge. I figured that "M" would just ignore the email but I rec'd an almost immediate response .. his grandfather was one of the twins, he had a close relationship with our Aunt and that another second cousin, who lived in California, had contacted him in the Summer.

My second cousin in California and I became and are very close. He told me that when he first contacted our second cousin in Denmark, that he was given a hard time and finally they made contact and were close for a time. We put our heads together, traced many family members and found documents mainly thanks to the Family Search and Ellis Island websites. I've traced twelve of the fifteen siblings to Ellis Island .. the oldest died in the Ukraine (other than his name, nothing is known about him or two missing siblings. We've found, emailed and spoken with members from all the siblings families except for one brother who while some of us recall him or him being mentioned, I can't find any documents to date after he landed on Ellis Island.

One of my second cousins is a really lovely woman (we've become close) who was one of the original Freedom Riders after hearing a speech in California by MLK.

I've encountered other "K" family but can't close the relationship, we all seem to have come from the town of Zinkov in the Ukraine. I should do an DNS test at some point to close or eliminate the circle.

Most of my research was done from late December 2013 to early 2015. I've hit so many blank walls but do search from time to time.
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Re: Genealogy

Postby Flower » 25 Nov 2021, 13:33

A few tips ....

Spelling doesn't count. For example volunteers (bless them) had taken handwritten manifests and certificates to translate. Sometimes you really have to look at the manifests and/or certificates themselves and think a bit out of the box. On one of my uncle's marriage certificates .. Sara was mistaken for Lana. My grandfather's Hebrew name was Srulik, which is often shortened to Srul but the capital S was mistaken for a Capital A and it was translated as Arul. All the other information on the documents were correct but don't skip past something because of spelling errors.

I had an uncle who the family called Shirl but he's on documents as Sam, Sol or Saul.

Good luck to all who are researching .. it is rewarding and frustrating at the same time.
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Re: Genealogy

Postby der Freiherr » 25 Nov 2021, 15:54

All of my family were protestant Germans (and Czechs) who came directly to TX in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. There isn't much mystery there, it's all in untangling exactly where they came from in Europe. I have a pretty good idea where they all came from (northern Germany, modern day Poland, Moravia), it's a question of digging beyond their departure points. It's those records I'm curious about.
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