BCB 100 - Van Morrison

Hare Brained · Postby **Hare Brained** » 26 Jun 2006, 20:42

Pete Townshend's a tosser but he gets forgiven for that. Whereas Van doesn't. I've been to concerts where he's been a little truculent but still I managed to enjoy the music. True, he's a grumpy arse, and difficult to work with and for. But so are a lot of people - I'd rather listen to a talented grumpy arse than an untalented grumpy arse - musically and conversationally.

The Slider · Postby **The Slider** » 26 Jun 2006, 20:46

Pete Townshend might be surly and drunk sometimes, but when was the last time you went to see The Who and they played their new album (with some whiny cunt you have never heard of singing all the lead vocals) in it's entirity plus a half-hearted My Generation just to keep the hardcore happy?

I even saw him play a solo show in 81ish where he was drunk and beligerent, but still played a blinder.

Not even in the same league as that miserable old fuckwit. :lol:

frimleygreener · Postby **frimleygreener** » 26 Jun 2006, 20:55

something not recognised at large are the great bands that van has assembled over the decades....old ivan may be a curmudgeon...but he keeps it real and on the road...fair play to the miserable old git:)

My name is Spaulding · Postby **My name is Spaulding** » 26 Jun 2006, 23:33

frimleygreener wrote:something not recognised at large are the great bands that van has assembled over the decades....

the band he ended up with in the Healing Game deserves a mention... with Georgie Fame on the Hammond organ and Pee Wee Ellis doing the horn arrangements

The Slider · Postby **The Slider** » 26 Jun 2006, 23:36

Not much point in him having a great band if all he does is lurk at the back occasionally honking on his sax and glowering at the audience. And sending Brian fucking Kennedy up to the mic to do all the singing for him.

My name is Spaulding · Postby **My name is Spaulding** » 26 Jun 2006, 23:40

The Slider wrote:Not much point in him having a great band if all he does is lurk at the back occasionally honking on his sax and glowering at the audience. And sending Brian fucking Kennedy up to the mic to do all the singing for him.

I know you´re just creating an exaggerated picture, but I tell you John, that on a good night, the man is still capable of creating sheer magic on the stage.

Even with Brian Kennedy on his band (he hasn´t been for ages), as the fantastic "San Francisco" live album proves.

the masked man · Postby **the masked man** » 26 Jun 2006, 23:44

Well, having seen my own bad Van Morrison gig, I don't think The Slider is painting an exaggerated picture at all. In my many years of gig-going I've never seen an artist show such naked contempt for his audience.

Maybe he can still produce magic live, but frankly he's ripped me off once. I don't feel like lining his pockets again.

My name is Spaulding · Postby **My name is Spaulding** » 26 Jun 2006, 23:49

the masked man wrote:Well, having seen my own bad Van Morrison gig, I don't think The Slider is painting an exaggerated picture at all. In my many years of gig-going I've never seen an artist show such naked contempt for his audience.

Maybe he can still produce magic live, but frankly he's ripped me off once. I don't feel like lining his pockets again.

Fair enough.

Maybe I´ve been lucky, since all I know about him live comes from "It´s too late to stop now", the San Francisco album, and the 5 amazing concerts that I´ve been lucky enough to witness.
Measuring that, I cannot say anything bad about his live performance, but I do have heard the legends about those bad Van nights.

Clippernolan · Postby **Clippernolan** » 26 Jun 2006, 23:53

This is not the first series of stories I've heard about Morrison's erratic behaviour. Why do you think he approaches performance this way on occasion?

the masked man · Postby **the masked man** » 27 Jun 2006, 00:02

In answer to your question, I get the impression that Morrison is extremely solipistic. He's reached a position where he's achieved success without really selling out to commercial considerations. He's got where he is by being truculent, and unfortunately this has affected his attitude to performances. If I might don my amateur psychologist's hat, I think he equates respecting his audience's needs with 'selling out'.

So, he'll play good gigs if he's in the mood, but if he isn't, then the audience has to accept it.

It is quite startling - you'd think that Hare and Spaulding were descibing a different performer to the one that The Slider and myself have seen. Basically, they've just been lucky in the way that I haven't.

Clippernolan · Postby **Clippernolan** » 27 Jun 2006, 00:08

the masked man wrote:In answer to your question, I get the impression that Morrison is extremely solipistic. He's reached a position where he's achieved success without really selling out to commercial considerations. He's got where he is by being truculent, and unfortunately this has affected his attitude to performances. If I might don my amateur psychologist's hat, I think he equates respecting his audience's needs with 'selling out'.

So, he'll play good gigs if he's in the mood, but if he isn't, then the audience has to accept it.

It is quite startling - you'd think that Hare and Spaulding were descibing a different performer to the one that The Slider and myself have seen. Basically, they've just been lucky in the way that I haven't.

So basically this is his version of Miles Davis playing with his back to the audience because he's Miles Davis.

the masked man · Postby **the masked man** » 27 Jun 2006, 00:10

In a nutshell, yes.

Clippernolan · Postby **Clippernolan** » 27 Jun 2006, 00:15

the masked man wrote:In a nutshell, yes.

What a bore.

In reading a Morrison interview (I can't remember which), I was struck by his dedication to being pissed off. When the interviewer suggested that many respected artists owe Morrison a debt in terms of style and presentation, instead of reacting the way anyone else would when being flattered effectively("well, I'm just doing what I'm doing and passing it along, blah blah") he said that it bothered him to see his influence in the work of others because he feels ripped off!

Oscar · Postby **Oscar** » 27 Jun 2006, 00:30

Album: Astral Weeks
Track: Come Here My Love

copehead · Postby **copehead** » 27 Jun 2006, 01:02

I've seen the old cunt 3 times.

One was an absolute stinker where he played jazz-wank for 2hrs, played a shit jazz-wank version of Moonlight, honked his sax for a bit and pissed off.

One show was OK, lloked a bit moody, bit jazz-wanky, but there were recognisable songs and he was singing well.

One show was a transcedental experience where the band was rocking and he did a version of gloria that left me with a smile on my face for days, he looked like he was enjoying himself and he played the hits and the good stuff straight up with a fine band, what more could you want?

geoffcowgill · Postby **geoffcowgill** » 27 Jun 2006, 01:24

The only time I've seen him live was in '99 at the Guinness Fleadh festival in Chicago. I'd heard about how cantankerous he could be, so I got really nervous when after four or five songs, he just walked off stage during a number. He came back after what seemed quite a long time, only to leave again after another song or two. Turns out he was apparently going back to get Elvis Costello to come out and duet with him (which I'm sure wasn't a hard thing to do). I had a wild notion that maybe this was what was going on. They did some very unrehearsed (but charmingly so) versions of "Jackie Wilson Said" and "Gloria". It was lovely.

mentalist (slight return) · Postby **mentalist (slight return)** » 27 Jun 2006, 03:01

It apears I'm lucky never to have witnessed him live, although Too Late To Stop Now and the Grand Opera House Belfast live albums are both excellent.

Album: Astral Weeks
Song: Saint Dominic's Preview

Yyzlin · Postby **Yyzlin** » 27 Jun 2006, 05:02

Astral Weeks is the greatest album ever recorded. And his output throughout the 70's is top notch, with great albums like Moondance, Vendon's Fleece, and Saint Dominic's. Haven't heard anything past that, and don't particularly care to. Easily one of the greatest songwriters ever. There was simply magic in his music.

The Slider · Postby **The Slider** » 27 Jun 2006, 09:33

I'm sure he does still sometimes tear the place up live.
But like TMM said - we have just been unlucky.

But I won't fork out for him again - just like I won't for Dylan or anyone else that shows that level of contempt for people paying £50 a shot.

Tactful Cactus · Postby **Tactful Cactus** » 27 Jun 2006, 09:39

The Slider wrote:But I won't fork out for him again - just like I won't for Dylan or anyone else that shows that level of contempt for people paying £50 a shot.

And didnt he do a club gig recently, charing something like £150 a pop?
Even more of a reason to despise him.