BCB 100 - The Smiths

Matt Wilson · Postby **Matt Wilson** » 19 Jun 2006, 20:21

Here's the next song on their debut:

You've Got Everything Now

As merry as the days were long
I was right and you were wrong
Back at the old grey school
I would win and you would lose So it's a tale of two guys (school friends?) and how they've ended up years later...

But you've got everything now
You've got everything now
And what a terrible mess I've made of my life
Oh, what a mess I've made of my life

No, I've never had a job
Because I've never wanted one
I've seen you smile
But I've never really heard you laugh
So who is rich and who is poor ?
I cannot say ... oh

You are your mother's only son
And you're a desperate one
Oh ...
But I don't want a lover
I just want to be seen ... oh ... in the back of your car Well, that's it then. Are you going to argue that there isn't a homosexual aspect of that statement? Hell, it isn't even a subtext in this song.

A friendship sadly lost ?
Well this is true ... and yet, It's false It's false becaue they never really were "friends." Lovers, probably.
Oh ...
But did I ever tell you, by the way ?
I never did like your face

But you've got everything now
You've got everything now
And what a terrible mess I've made of my life
Oh, what a mess I've made of my life

No, I've never had a job
Because I'm too shy
I've seen you smile
But I've never really heard you laugh
So who is rich and who is poor ?
I cannot say ... oh

Oscar · Postby **Oscar** » 19 Jun 2006, 20:28

Matt Wilson wrote:Here's the next song on their debut:

You've Got Everything Now

He clearly says "I don't want a lover, I just want to be seen in the back of your car". Look again, I - don't - want - a - lover. Either from an asexual/celibate standpoint or from the perspective of a woman. Who's to say?

Next! Make it a good one this time.

Owen · Postby **Owen** » 19 Jun 2006, 20:28

the giraffe is back wrote:
Owen wrote: amusing in a slightly depressing way.

you've summed them up pretty well, there.

Matt Wilson · Postby **Matt Wilson** » 19 Jun 2006, 20:33

Pretty Girls Make Graves

Upon the sand, upon the bay
"There is a quick and easy way" you say
Before you illustrate
I'd rather state :
"I'm not the man you think I am
I'm not the man you think I am" He's not a heterosexual, in other words.
And Sorrow's native son
He will not smile for anyone

And Pretty Girls Make Graves
Oh ...

End of the pier, end of the bay
You tug my arm, and say : "Give in to lust,
Give up to lust, oh heaven knows we'll
Soon be dust ... "
Oh, I'm not the man you think I am
I'm not the man you think I am She wants some from Morrisey. Oh, is she barking up the wrong tree...

I could have been wild and I could have
Been free
But Nature played this trick on me This trick of making him gay, I guess.

She wants it Now
And she will not wait
But she's too rough
And I'm too delicate The girl is rougher than him.

Then, on the sand
Another man, he takes her hand
A smile lights up her face
(and well, it would) Of course it would. He's not gay.

I lost my faith in Womanhood
I lost my faith in Womanhood
I lost my faith ...
Oh ... Poor Morissey.

Hand in glove ...
The sun shines out of our behinds ... I'm sure he loved writing this.
Oh ...

Owen · Postby **Owen** » 19 Jun 2006, 20:38

Classic Prof wrote:Anyway, Owen I think it will have been ALB mentioning the person on the cover of one of his records being a lover. I don't think I did.

just seen this, yes i think you're right, sorry,

Oscar · Postby **Oscar** » 19 Jun 2006, 20:39

Matt Wilson wrote: Pretty Girls Make Graves

Celibacy

Matt Wilson wrote: Hand in glove ...
The sun shines out of our behinds ...

Hmmmm. I'll pass on that one for a while.

Matt Wilson · Postby **Matt Wilson** » 19 Jun 2006, 20:42

Oscar wrote:
Matt Wilson wrote: Pretty Girls Make Graves

Celibacy

Celibacy?
So nature played the trick of celibacy on him? :lol:

You're truly grasping at straws now.

Oscar · Postby **Oscar** » 19 Jun 2006, 20:59

Matt Wilson wrote:
Oscar wrote:
Matt Wilson wrote: Pretty Girls Make Graves

Celibacy

Celibacy?
So nature played the trick of celibacy on him?

You're truly grasping at straws now.

I think celibacy is the cruelest trick. It means you ain't getting any at all. Why wouldn't he write songs about celibacy? Wouldn't it reinforce his claim?

Matt Wilson · Postby **Matt Wilson** » 19 Jun 2006, 21:06

But why was he celibate?
Who was he saving it for? Do you think he wanted to marry the guy before he gave it up?

Honestly, Oscar--methinks you doth protest too much.

Penk! · Postby **Penk!** » 19 Jun 2006, 21:08

Oscar wrote:the only direction you could all move in was the cheap n nasty "Morrissey is a gay!" stance.

Surely you've done this enough times to realise that that is the only reason any of us dislike them?

Oscar · Postby **Oscar** » 19 Jun 2006, 21:14

Matt Wilson wrote:But why was he celibate?
Who was he saving it for? Do you think he wanted to marry the guy before he gave it up?

Honestly, Oscar--methinks you doth protest too much.

I think a possible reason for his celibacy was/is is his inability to come to terms with his sexuality, whatever that may be. Either way, he persistently claimed to be celibate and I think that this was the perspective he sometimes used in his lyrics.

Oscar · Postby **Oscar** » 19 Jun 2006, 21:15

Penk wrote:
Oscar wrote:the only direction you could all move in was the cheap n nasty "Morrissey is a gay!" stance.

Surely you've done this enough times to realise that that is the only reason any of us dislike them?

Yes, but I enjoy toying with you all.

The Modernist · Postby **The Modernist** » 19 Jun 2006, 21:18

The truth is Morrissey's lyrics were deliberately ambiguous gender-wise which actually gave them a certain attractive mystery. There was certainly a homoeroticism to some of it, but frankly so fuckin' what.
Why has this become a point of criticism?

Penk! · Postby **Penk!** » 19 Jun 2006, 21:21

The Unique Modernist! wrote:The truth is Morrissey's lyrics were deliberately ambiguous gender-wise which actually gave them a certain attractive mystery. There was certainly a homoeroticism to some of it, but frankly so fuckin' what.
Why has this become a point of criticism?

See my post near the top of page 11.

Owen · Postby **Owen** » 19 Jun 2006, 21:23

Penk wrote:
The Unique Modernist! wrote:The truth is Morrissey's lyrics were deliberately ambiguous gender-wise which actually gave them a certain attractive mystery. There was certainly a homoeroticism to some of it, but frankly so fuckin' what.
Why has this become a point of criticism?

See my post near the top of page 11.

Or just save time get into the spirit of the thread and criticise something totally different you think somebody might have said in their silly smiths hating way.

Penk! · Postby **Penk!** » 19 Jun 2006, 21:25

Owen wrote:
Penk wrote:
The Unique Modernist! wrote:The truth is Morrissey's lyrics were deliberately ambiguous gender-wise which actually gave them a certain attractive mystery. There was certainly a homoeroticism to some of it, but frankly so fuckin' what.
Why has this become a point of criticism?

See my post near the top of page 11.

Or just save time get into the spirit of the thread and criticise something totally different you think somebody might have said in their silly smiths hating way.

It's not even stuff we've said though, it's just that they're so paranoid from listening to all that miserable Smiths stuff that they have to get in with their defences in anticipation of us coming up with new things to dislike about them.

The Modernist · Postby **The Modernist** » 19 Jun 2006, 21:26

Penk wrote:
The Unique Modernist! wrote:The truth is Morrissey's lyrics were deliberately ambiguous gender-wise which actually gave them a certain attractive mystery. There was certainly a homoeroticism to some of it, but frankly so fuckin' what.
Why has this become a point of criticism?

See my post near the top of page 11.

Well I looked , but I can't see what you've said relevent to what I've just said.

copehead · Postby **copehead** » 19 Jun 2006, 21:26

Matt Wilson wrote:[You can pin and mount me like a butterfly "Pin and mount me" He's not addressing a woman, Oscar...
But "take me to the haven of your bed"
Was something that you never said
Two lumps, please
You're the bee's knees
But so am I

Oh, meet me at the fountain
Shove me on the patio
I'll take it slowly Once again--pretty explicit.
Oh ...

How literal you are. Is it inconceivable that a man would assume the persona of a woman to sing a song.

There is no mention of gender in the song, and anyone who thinks you can't be mounted by a woman if you are a man lacks experience and imagination.

One up to Oscar I'd say

Penk! · Postby **Penk!** » 19 Jun 2006, 21:28

The Unique Modernist! wrote:I can't see what you've said relevent to what I've just said.

I meant that it had become a point of criticism because the self-loathing fans wanted it to be but your post sums up this thread pretty well anyway

Matt Wilson · Postby **Matt Wilson** » 19 Jun 2006, 21:28

Jarg Armani wrote: How literal you are. Is it inconceivable that a man would assume the persona of a woman to sing a song.

There is no mention of gender in the song, and anyone who thinks you can't be mounted by a woman if you are a man lacks experience and imagination.

One up to Oscar I'd say

Looks like somebody else is in denial then. :lol: