Genesis

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Lord Rother
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Re: Genesis

Postby Lord Rother » 08 Oct 2021, 20:37

That’s one way of looking at it, yes. :D

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Mike Boom
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Re: Genesis

Postby Mike Boom » 08 Oct 2021, 22:25

Matt Wilson wrote:I could have sworn "Lay Your Hands On Me" was on his 1983 live album, but I guess it's not. I even put it in my review, but had to check after I hit submit. Nope, don't know what I was thinking. I deleted that part.

Didn't he go out in the crowd while they passed him around overhead while singing that song? A lifetime of abuse both mental and physical has made me the sad excuse for a man whose company you currently enjoy.




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Re: Genesis

Postby Matt Wilson » 08 Oct 2021, 22:54

Ha! vindicated... I must have remembered that video and thought it was on the live album.
it's weird how carlsson has managed to get wilson over a barrel and then persuade him to let the rest of the PROG goons perform anal chugs on him in said position.

my point is that wilson has sold his arse cheaply. it's embarrassing to read.

-skope

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Re: Genesis

Postby The Slider » 09 Oct 2021, 12:17

Didn't the live album get truncated for its first cd issue?
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Re: Genesis

Postby Positive Passion » 09 Oct 2021, 12:30

The Slider wrote:Didn't the live album get truncated for its first cd issue?


Yes indeed, but Lay your hands on me is not on it, even in its truncated version.

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Re: Genesis

Postby The Slider » 09 Oct 2021, 12:34

Right so
I do have a copy but I've never really taken to it so I am not overly familiar
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Re: Genesis

Postby Matt Wilson » 13 Oct 2021, 18:40

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Phil Collins - Hello, I Must Be Going! 1982
Son of Face Value, really - and not quite as good either, although you'd be forgiven for not noticing as they're so similar they could be the same album. All vestiges of progressive rock are gone now in favor of what worked the first time around: Relationship songs, the Earth, Wind, and Fire horns, ballads, gated drums and eighties production values. The Marx Brothers allusion in the title, and the color photo on the LP cover are about the only things new in the proceedings that I can think of worth mentioning. The 1982 Phil LP variant is a carbon copy of the 1981 debut, and as with any time an artist chooses to make the same album over again, it didn't sell in the numbers enjoyed previously. However, that doesn't mean it didn't do well. Indeed, anything to do with Collins or Genesis, for that matter in 1982, would have sold in large numbers, and Hello, I Must Be Going! was no exception.

I don't want to sound like I'm down on the record though - it works fine and succeeds in the same manner as Face Value. I'm much more accepting of this stuff now from the vantage of 2021 than I was then.

Phil Collins – vocals, drums, keyboards (1–4, 6, 7, 9), bass pedals (1, 4, 9), percussion (2, 6, 9), handclaps (3), timpani (4), trumpet (4), tambourine (5), marimba (7), piano (8, 10)
Daryl Stuermer – guitars (1–9)
John Giblin – bass guitar (2, 3, 5, 8)
Mo Foster – bass guitar (6, 7)
J. Peter Robinson – piano, vibraphone and glockenspiel (5)
The Phenix Horns – horns (2, 6, 9)
Michael Harris – trumpet
Rahmlee Michael Davis – trumpet
Don Myrick – alto and tenor saxophones, alto sax solo (2, 9)
Louis "Louie Louie" Satterfield – trombone
The Phenix Choir – additional vocals (2)
The Mountain Fjord Orchestra – strings (5, 8, 10)
Martyn Ford – string arrangements and conductor
Gavyn Wright – orchestra leader

All tracks are written by Phil Collins, except "You Can't Hurry Love" by Holland–Dozier–Holland.

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1. "I Don't Care Anymore" 5:00
A strong start to the record is established with "I Don't Care Anymore." The drums are similar to "In the Air Tonight" and the same vitriol is present. I love it though and Phil seemed to lose the desire to spew forth anger once these divorce songs were exorcised from his psyche in the early '80s. I missed them!

"I Don't Care Anymore" is a song written, performed, and produced by English drummer Phil Collins (with co-production by Hugh Padgham). It is the third single from Collins' second solo album, Hello, I Must Be Going! (1982). It is one of the artist's most recognizable signature songs, and a favorite of many Collins fans worldwide.

This song is considered 'dark' in tone, and is comparable to Collins' earlier hit single "In the Air Tonight", as both contain powerful drum kit along with simplistic synthesizers and guitar riffs, coupled with angry lyrics directed at Collins' failed first marriage. The drums also illustrate the gated reverb recording technique that defined Collins' sound throughout the 1980s. During "I Don't Care Anymore", the drum track switches several times between "standard" studio sound and a gated reverb overlay. The song earned Collins his first Grammy Award nomination for Best Male Rock Vocal Performance in 1984, but lost to Michael Jackson's "Beat It".

In addition to Chester Thompson, touring band members Daryl Stuermer (guitar), Peter Robinson (keyboards), and Mo Foster (bass) also appear. Aside from Stuermer, the rest of the band does not appear on the actual recording and are instead miming Collins's parts.

The video is staged entirely in a dark room, with spotlights appearing over each band member as they begin to play. Foster is clearly visible in Robinson's spotlight for about a minute before he begins to play, hands in pockets, shuffling his feet occasionally, and looking more like a loiterer than a band member. When he begins to play (at the beginning of the first chorus), he plays the song's synthesized bass line on Moog Taurus bass pedals. Instead of playing them with his feet as intended by the manufacturer, he strikes them somewhat dramatically with the sides of his closed fists. He plays considerably more notes than what is actually heard, and frequently manipulates the Taurus's filter controls with one hand while striking with the other.

Live concert footage from the same year shows that Foster did, in fact, play the Taurus with his hands (whereas future touring bassist Leland Sklar played the Taurus with his feet while simultaneously playing electric bass). He did not strike the pedals with his fist, however, instead simply depressing each pedal with the flat of his hand. He did frequently manipulate the Taurus's filters to great effect, but the bass line he performed was the simplified version heard on the recording rather than the overzealous part he mimed in the video." - Wikipedia

2. "I Cannot Believe It's True" 5:14
Those EW&F horns enliven any Phil tune and they all sound like hits to me. Another good 'un. Wiki - "I Cannot Believe It's True" is a song by Phil Collins from his second solo album Hello, I Must Be Going!. The sixth single released from the album, the song was only released as a single in the United States; internationally, it was instead released as the B-side of "You Can't Hurry Love". The song found moderate success on the Billboard Hot 100, reaching #79."

3. "Like China" 5:05
Collins sings in a Cockney accent here which adds to the appeal. His Artful Dodger voice was rare, and it always stands out to me. Maybe people across the pond feel differently, I don't know. Wikipedia: "The song, the third track on the album, takes a cheerful rock music tone. It opens with Collins singing with a British Cockney accent. The song takes an upbeat tempo and features a discordant guitar introduction, as well as a guitar solo by Daryl Stuermer midway through the song.

The title is a traditional English expression meaning "gently and with great care". The lyrics portray an infatuated teenager attempting to convince a girl to date him despite their different social backgrounds — as emphasized by the singer's affected Cockney accent and his reference to being from "the other side of town". In doing this, the narrator says he will treat her as gently as china.

The single was released in 1983 as the last of seven singles from Hello, I Must Be Going!. It was released on 7" and 12" formats, with the B-side being "I Cannot Believe It's True", which had previously been released as a single from the album. In the US, the single reached the top 20 of the Billboard Mainstream Rock Tracks chart, reaching #17.

"Like China" had also previously been released as the B-side for the single "Why Can't It Wait 'Til Morning?", the fifth single from Hello, I Must Be Going."

4. "Do You Know, Do You Care?" 4:57
The first one which really doesn't grab me. Same gated drums with a mid-tempo pattern, and I can't even remember the melody when it's over. Sounds like him, though.

"Hugh Fielder of Sounds praised Hello, I Must Be Going! as "a broader, stronger and better executed follow-up to Face Value", writing, "The original inspiration may be second-hand but the execution and character is entirely his." In Rolling Stone, John Milward said of the record: "Despite its trend-bucking boast of an eight-track recording, the album's rich luster is of the old classical-rock school. In fact, the LP sounds like stripped-down Genesis, ornamental but not too ostentatious." NME writer Graham K. Smith was less enthused, criticizing the lyrics as excessively self-pitying and the music as steeped in "blatant textbook commercialities"; he found that the album "resoundly collapses between the two stools of 'meaningful rock' and disposable pop, wallowing in all the worst aspects of both with none of the saving graces".

Retrospectively, AllMusic critic Stephen Thomas Erlewine stated that Collins "began to inject his highly melodic pop songwriting with more soul and R&B influences" on Hello, I Must Be Going!, with mixed results: "While some of the material was successful, much of it showed that he was still coming to grips with how to incorporate R&B techniques into his style." In a later review of the album for AllMusic, Tim Sendra was more favorable, deeming it "a winning follow-up that shows Collins to be in full control of songwriting and production". - Wiki

5. "You Can't Hurry Love" 2:57
By far the biggest hit on the album, this virtual note-for-note cover of the Supremes song was all over the radio and MTV at the time. I must admit that prior to hearing this CD again, I hadn't heard this track in ages.

Wikipedia: "The most notable cover of the song was released in November 1982 as a single by Phil Collins from his second solo album, Hello, I Must Be Going! Collins's version reached number-one on the UK Singles Chart for two weeks in January 1983 (becoming his first number-one solo hit in the UK Singles Chart, and peaking two positions higher than the original song did in that country), and reached number 10 in the United States. The single was certified gold in the UK. The orchestral strings on this track were recorded in Studio 1 at CBS Recording Studios, London W1 by Recording Engineer Mike Ross-Trevor (assisted by Richard Hollywood) on the evening of Thursday 24 June 1982. Although Collins had previously done covers as album tracks (of Genesis's "Behind the Lines" and The Beatles' "Tomorrow Never Knows" on Face Value), "You Can't Hurry Love" was the first cover he released as a single. Collins explained:

The idea of doing 'Can't Hurry Love' was to see if Hugh Padgham and I could duplicate that Sixties sound. It's very difficult today because most recording facilities are so much more sophisticated than they were back then. It's therefore hard to make the drums sound as rough as they did on the original. That's what we were going after, a remake, not an interpretation, but a remake. Collins's version was the first track on the very first Now That's What I Call Music compilation CD in November 1983. In his version of the song, he changes "And I need to find, find / Someone to call mine" in the first verse to "And I need to find time / Someone to call mine." On the second repeat of the chorus, he replaces the line "How much more can I take?" with "How much more must I take?", and likewise exchanges the words, "you gotta just give it time..." to "just trust in a good time...".

In 1983, the music video was released on the home video Phil Collins available on Video Home System (VHS) and LaserDisc (LD) which received a Grammy nomination for Best Video, Short Form. The video itself was also the first track featured on the first VHS compilation of Now: That's What I Call Music.

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6. "It Don't Matter to Me" 4:12
Side two begins with another EW&F horns-driven tune. He could have done an entire album of this material and I wouldn't have minded.

Wiki: "In December 1981, Collins's band Genesis entered an eight-month break in activity after touring Abacab (1981). He started work on a follow-up to his first solo album, Face Value (1981), which mainly concerned events in his personal life including his divorce from his first wife. Collins was aware that Hello, I Must Be Going! contains even greater amounts of material concerning his private life, and reasoned its concentration down to feeling guilty regarding the divorce and "to be purely sentimental about it". He described the album years later: "If my first album was 'I'm divorced and I'm miserable' ... my next one was 'I'm going to kick this fucker to bits'". However, upon meeting his second wife Jill Tavelman and releasing Hello, I Must Be Going!, Collins noted a change in his songwriting: "[I'm] happier [...] I write happy songs now".

The album features elements of groove pop that Collins would utilize further with his next album, No Jacket Required (1985). "I Cannot Believe It's True" has been compared to "I Missed Again" from Face Value "right down to the undulating rhythms and swaying brass". Collins confessed to "a distinct lack of judgement" in recording the drums for "Thru These Walls" as the drum fill he used matched what he had done for "In the Air Tonight" from Face Value. To him, that is the sole comparison between the two albums, despite being called out for rehashing similar material for Hello, I Must Be Going!"

7. "Thru These Walls" 5:02
The first ballad coming this far into the album shows Phil's happier frame of mind during the recording of this record. Or maybe not if you listen to the words! LOL "The song is dark, which follows a vast majority of songs from the album, and is about a man listening through the wall to his neighbors partaking in sexual activities. The song has distinct similarities with Collins's debut solo single "In The Air Tonight", featuring similar atmospheric opening chords on a Sequential Circuits Prophet-5 and also utilized the same gated reverb drum part several times. The song also features one of Collins's attempts at a "Ringo Starr drum part", who is one of his biggest influences as a drummer.

The song was the first single by Collins that did not reach the Top 20 in the UK, peaking at No. 56 in the UK Singles Chart (it was not released as a single in the U.S.)" - Wikipedia

Which is surprising considering it's one of the least listener-friendly tracks here.

8. "Don't Let Him Steal Your Heart Away" 4:43
And here's another slower one. You guys know how I feel about Phil's slower numbers, so further explication is pointless. The pace does pick up though, so I'm not quite sure this really qualifies as a ballad. "Don't Let Him Steal Your Heart Away" is a song by Phil Collins from his second solo album Hello, I Must Be Going!. The song was the fourth single released from the album and failed to reach the top 40 in the UK. It is notable for its 3D sleeve.

It was eventually released to adult contemporary stations in the USA in 2004, from his Love Songs compilation album, reaching #5." - Wikipedia

Interesting, I don't think I've ever heard this on the radio.

9. "The West Side" 4:59
The horns are back, and so is what sounds like a trumpet. A distinct jazzy vibe marks this as different from the other tracks. I don't mind it really, and it's probably preferable to the two previous numbers. I guess he didn't bother to write lyrics to this one other than "yeah" stretched out over a few bars.

Wiki - "Hello, I Must Be Going! received a more reserved commercial reaction than Face Value, but it nonetheless reached No. 2 in the United Kingdom and No. 8 in the United States. In total, Collins released eight singles from the album, with various tracks released as singles in different countries. The most successful was the first US and second UK single, a cover of "You Can't Hurry Love" by The Supremes, which went to No. 1 in the United Kingdom and No. 10 in the United States. Collins supported the album with his 1982–1983 tour, his first as a solo artist. The album earned Collins a Brit Award nomination for British Male Artist in 1983, and "I Don't Care Anymore" was nominated for a Grammy Award for Best Rock Vocal Performance, Male.

10. "Why Can't It Wait 'Til Morning" 3:01
More slow tempos as Collins explores the ballad side of his music yet again. No, I'm not gonna pay attention to what he's singing about. I can guess. I'd rather listen to his closing Beatles number on the last album. This was another single in the UK.

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Last edited by Matt Wilson on 14 Oct 2021, 18:24, edited 3 times in total.
it's weird how carlsson has managed to get wilson over a barrel and then persuade him to let the rest of the PROG goons perform anal chugs on him in said position.

my point is that wilson has sold his arse cheaply. it's embarrassing to read.

-skope

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Lord Rother
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Re: Genesis

Postby Lord Rother » 13 Oct 2021, 22:34

I actually prefer HIMBG to FV - just.

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Re: Genesis

Postby trans-chigley express » 14 Oct 2021, 00:48

I like HIMBG quite a lot. I love both The West Side and Do You Know, Do You Care, two of the album's highlights for me

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Re: Genesis

Postby The Slider » 14 Oct 2021, 14:35

It is certainly a more cohesive record and he learned to to do the brassy pop songs better.
I think there are a couple of peaks on FV that are more compelling - In The Air, The Roof is Leaking, Droned/Hand in Hand - but those aside I like HIMBG more as a whole.
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Re: Genesis

Postby Mike Boom » 14 Oct 2021, 17:32

Matt Wilson wrote:Side two begins with another EW&F horns-driven tune. He could have done an entire album of this material and I wouldn't have minded.



1. Saturday Night and Sunday Morning
2. Sussudio
3. Behind the Lines
4. No Reply at All
5. I Missed Again
6. Paperlate
7. The West Side
8. Hand in Hand

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Re: Genesis

Postby trans-chigley express » 15 Oct 2021, 05:14

Mike Boom wrote:
Matt Wilson wrote:Side two begins with another EW&F horns-driven tune. He could have done an entire album of this material and I wouldn't have minded.



1. Saturday Night and Sunday Morning
2. Sussudio
3. Behind the Lines
4. No Reply at All
5. I Missed Again
6. Paperlate
7. The West Side
8. Hand in Hand


Sussudio is horrible. It Don't Matter to Me and/or I Cannot Believe it's True can replace it

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Re: Genesis

Postby Mike Boom » 15 Oct 2021, 15:43

trans-chigley express wrote:Sussudio is horrible.


I guess its just me and Patrick Bateman :?

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Re: Genesis

Postby Matt Wilson » 18 Oct 2021, 16:42

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Steve Hackett - Spectral Mornings 1979
Should have reviewed this earlier, but I only heard it for the first time recently. It's quite good, if a lesser album than Voyage of the Acolyte in my estimation. Since I wrote about nothing in the Genesis camp for '79, this will be it, closing the lid (for me, anyway) on this thread. As always, the invitation is open for anyone else to write about any post '82 Genesis record.

Steve Hackett – electric and acoustic guitars, Roland GR-500 guitar synthesizer, lead vocals and harmonica on "The Ballad of the Decomposing Man", harmony/backing vocals on "Every Day" and "The Virgin and the Gypsy", koto on "The Red Flowers of Tachai Blooms Everywhere"
Pete Hicks – lead vocals on "Every Day", "The Virgin and the Gypsy", and "Tigermoth"
Dik Cadbury – bass guitar, harmony/backing vocals on "Every Day", "The Virgin and the Gypsy", and "Tigermoth", Moog Taurus bass pedals, violin on "The Ballad of the Decomposing Man"
Nick Magnus – keyboards, Vox String Thing, Novatron, clavinet, Fender Rhodes & RMI electric pianos, Minimoog, Mini-Korg 700, Roland String Synth RS-202 & SH-2000, harpsichord on "The Virgin and the Gypsy"
John Hackett – flute, bamboo flute on "The Virgin and the Gypsy", Moog Taurus bass pedals on "Clocks - The Angel of Mons"
John Shearer – drums, percussion

All songs written by Steve Hackett.

"Every Day" – 6:14
The most traditional Genesis-sounding song on the album begins our second examination of a Steve Hackett record. Pete Hicks on vocals, which don't impress me, but aren't cringe-worthy either. Would have made a nice Duke tune had he still been around. The chords almost sound like something on The Lamb as well. If any cut here would have made it on the airwaves, this would have been it.

Wiki - "The album starts with "Every Day" which is an anti-drug song about Steve's own experiences of the drug culture when his first girlfriend fell victim to "Cleopatra's Needle", and it would become his signature song from his solo career with a guitar solo at the track's coda."

"The Virgin and the Gypsy" – 4:27
Pretty acoustic guitar, Hicks' vocals again, harmonies... Another effective, but perhaps slight tune awash with synths and flute (played by Steve's brother). Par for the course with prog, kids. Nice, and with a Genesis vibe too. Wiki - "The Virgin and the Gypsy" was inspired by the novella of the same name. It has an acoustic folk sound with vocal harmonies, twelve tracks of 12-string guitars mixed together, a guitar synthesizer solo, harpsichord and double-tracking flutes solos. Parts of the song were previously recorded in sessions for Please Don't Touch in an instrumental called "Seven of Cups".

"The Red Flower of Tachai Blooms Everywhere" – 2:05
Asian-toned instrumental which functions as a nice change of pace. "The Red Flower of Tachai Blooms Everywhere" was inspired by east-Asian culture. Hackett plays a Cantonese koto on the track, accompanied by a Mellotron imitating a Japanese singer, flute and gong percussion." - Wikipedia

"Clocks – The Angel of Mons" – 4:17
Instrumental number with clock sounds a la Pink Floyd and other songs I'm too tired to think of at the moment. Heavy synths, drums, and a pounding riff illustrate why Steve doesn't need vocals sometimes. After around 2:30 it really begins to sound like the music he wrote for Genesis.

Wikipedia: "Clocks - The Angel of Mons" was considered for a horror movie soundtrack. Drummer John Shearer plays a long drum solo at the climax of the track, the power of which Hackett compared to sounding like "being trampled by elephants". John Hackett plays a Moog Taurus bass pedal synthesizer on this track using his hands as opposed to his feet.

"The Ballad of the Decomposing Man" (featuring "The Office Party") – 3:49
Steve takes lead vocals here, showing us why he pays for singers elsewhere. Fun, but ultimately a novelty number and not indicative of what the rest of the LP sounds like. "The Ballad of the Decomposing Man" is sung by Hackett in a tongue-in-cheek George Formby-style, in which Hackett displays a sense of humor like songs on the previous Genesis albums with Peter Gabriel such as "Harold the Barrel". Hackett also plays the harmonica for the first time on his albums in this track. The second half of the song, "The Office Party" was played in a calypso style with a lot of percussion, violin from bassist Dik Cadbury and comical speaking." - Wiki

Image

"Lost Time in Córdoba" – 4:03
There's that almost medieval quality that some Genesis songs had here. I have time for almost all of the instrumentals on this LP, and this one is quite nice. I don't know that Hackett is particularly pushing himself with stuff like this, but it makes for pleasant background music. There's even room for an acoustic solo amidst the keyboards-which-sound-like-strings. Wiki: "Side two, opens with "Lost Time in Cordoba" which is a classical guitar and flute duet, in a style similar to Hackett's future classical guitar albums such as Bay of Kings.

"Tigermoth" – 7:35
Ominous chords and Hackett flailing away on guitar open this cut with a bang, then it's back to business as usual. Slow synths and spacey guitar effects tell us it's the '70s. Actually, ignore what I said earlier, this one could have used some vocals a bit earlier in the proceedings. When they finally come in you realize it's a song about the ghosts of aviators in wars telling the listener their stories. Pete Hicks sings.

Wiki - "Tigermoth" is a ghost story told from the perspectives of several pilots from the First World War, shot down whilst flying planes of the same name. The first half of the track has a dramatic feel with jarring Mellotron chords, bass pedals and guitar synthesizer. The acoustic second half contains Hicks's vocals and a lullaby ending.

"Spectral Mornings" – 6:33
This one is a highlight though, and doesn't need words. The most successful instrumental on the record and a fine show-closer. High lines on the guitar from our boy make for a nice melody and one that doesn't necessarily sound like his old band so much as it does him.

"The album finishes with the title track, which began life as a vocal piece. However, after Hackett played the vocal melody to his band on the guitar, Pete Hicks decided that the track sounded "great as it is", telling Hackett to "keep the piece as an instrumental", leading Hackett to joke later on that Hicks talked himself out of a job on the track. It has become his signature instrumental from his solo career. Many progressive rock guitarists, such as Steve Rothery (from Marillion), consider this track to be an inspiration." - Wikipedia
it's weird how carlsson has managed to get wilson over a barrel and then persuade him to let the rest of the PROG goons perform anal chugs on him in said position.

my point is that wilson has sold his arse cheaply. it's embarrassing to read.

-skope

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Re: Genesis

Postby Neil Jung » 18 Oct 2021, 20:50

Spectral Mornings is probably my second favourite of his, after the magnificent Please Don’t Touch. After really liking his last few albums I was disappointed with the latest one.
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Re: Genesis

Postby ConnyOlivetti » 19 Oct 2021, 08:22

Dont care much for this album, or any other after "Please Don't Touch"
No review of PDT?
For me his best album...
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Re: Genesis

Postby Purgatory Brite » 19 Oct 2021, 10:44



Any thoughts thoughts on this? I rather like it.

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Re: Genesis

Postby Neil Jung » 19 Oct 2021, 12:09

I have heard it before…. I do much prefer the original but this does perk up once he plays the flute and Mr Hackett does his thing. I thought the lyrics were a bit clunky, didn’t you?
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Re: Genesis

Postby Purgatory Brite » 19 Oct 2021, 12:29

Neil Jung wrote:I thought the lyrics were a bit clunky, didn’t you?


Slightly, but there's there's a few daffy lyrics in the Genesis back catalogue.

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Re: Genesis

Postby The Slider » 19 Oct 2021, 13:38

I like it
And he is a way better singer than any that SH has used since Please Don't Touch
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