Which Absolute Beginners?

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Your pick

ver Jam
9
38%
The Dame
15
63%
 
Total votes: 24

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Ranking Ted
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Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Ranking Ted » 12 Feb 2018, 17:11




The Bowie song has (rightly) become a BCB touchstone as an example of his flickering muse amidst the Glass Spiders and God Only Knows in the mid 80s. But the Jam's '81 single seems to have fallen off their map, frantic and brassy and, as it turns out, a sign of where Weller was going.

Do either of these float yer boat? Or both? Both rubbish? Thoughts?

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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Minnie Cheddars » 12 Feb 2018, 17:16

I love both, but the Dame is the clear winner here.
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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Positive Passion » 12 Feb 2018, 17:18

I like them both. The soundtrack to Absolute Beginners is actually quite good.

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Diamond Dog
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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Diamond Dog » 12 Feb 2018, 17:21

Bernie on FB wrote:I love both, but the Dame is the clear winner here.



Tick.
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The Modernist
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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby The Modernist » 12 Feb 2018, 17:30

I like The Jam single a lot. Its horn driven sound is seen as Weller getting increasingly soul influenced, but actually it was as influenced as much by contemporary singles by the likes of Teardrop Explodes and TV21 (punchy brass being one of 81/82s musical leitmotifs) as old soul records. I always liked the wistful reflection of its middle eight ( "I spent an hour..").
Like it as I do, it comes second to one of Bowie's most epic and romantic tunes. It tends to get a bit overlooked, being it's from the eighties, but as a pop single it can stand shoulder to shoulder with his best.

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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Diamond Dog » 12 Feb 2018, 18:56

I thought this version was the best too.

“Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.”
"Don't be seduced into thinking that which did not make a profit is without value"
"'Seize the moments as they fly, know to live and learn to die'."

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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Dor-Relip Hotels and Bathings » 12 Feb 2018, 19:29

The Bowie thing is the Dame in excelsis, isn't it? high-register crooning, overreaching chord changes, super-slick backing vocals. It's something of a showtune really (I guess that was the idea) - and it's preposterously overrated here. But it's affecting and sweet and inarguably a career peak.

The Jam demonstrate how fucking clueless they were when operating outside their tiresome provincial concerns - it's a shrill mess. A real dog's breakfast.
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Ranking Ted
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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Ranking Ted » 12 Feb 2018, 19:36

I’ve given the Jam a bit of a hospital pass with the poll options here, I think. I agree the Bowie song is the better of the two, elegant and elegiac, but the Jam track came on shuffle earlier and it’s a great, frenetic thing, definitely infused by that brass-driven trend of the times but with that great, classicist middle eight. It’s almost never included when the Jam are discussed now - a non LP single that fell quite a bit short of the apparently mandatory number one position. Love it.

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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Moleskin » 12 Feb 2018, 19:39

It's one of my favourite Jam singles, but a feeble thing next to the Bowie song.
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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Diamond Dog » 12 Feb 2018, 19:44

OCT wrote:The Bowie thing is the Dame in excelsis, isn't it? high-register crooning, overreaching chord changes, super-slick backing vocals. It's something of a showtune really (I guess that was the idea) - and it's preposterously overrated here.


What exactly is an 'over reaching chord change'?
“Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.”
"Don't be seduced into thinking that which did not make a profit is without value"
"'Seize the moments as they fly, know to live and learn to die'."

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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Ranking Ted » 12 Feb 2018, 19:56

K wrote:Would like to hear from someone who voted for The Jam.

Crikey, I thought this was a walkover until I actually submitted my vote!

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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Diamond Dog » 12 Feb 2018, 19:58

I think it was this kind of track that really pushed Weller to wanting a different drummer - I think Buckler is a good rock drummer (witness tracks like Funeral Pyre where he is excellent) but he sounds horribly out of place here...clumsy and fumbling and unable to find a drum pattern that really fits with the song.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.”
"Don't be seduced into thinking that which did not make a profit is without value"
"'Seize the moments as they fly, know to live and learn to die'."

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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Dor-Relip Hotels and Bathings » 12 Feb 2018, 20:07

Diamond Dog wrote:
OCT wrote:The Bowie thing is the Dame in excelsis, isn't it? high-register crooning, overreaching chord changes, super-slick backing vocals. It's something of a showtune really (I guess that was the idea) - and it's preposterously overrated here.


What exactly is an 'over reaching chord change'?


D Bm C#m Gdim
I've nothing much to offer, there's nothing much to take
G D C Bm Em A
I'm an absolute beginner, but I'm absolutely sane
D Bm C#m Gdim
As long as we're together, the rest may go to hell
G D C Bm
I absolutely love you, but we're absolute beginners
G D F# A
With eyes completely open, but nervous all the same
Darkness_Fish wrote:This is a big fucking mess of absolute shit from the off.

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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Minnie Cheddars » 12 Feb 2018, 20:11

Easy peasy
You come at the Queen, you best not miss.

Dr Markus wrote:
Someone in your line of work usually as their own man cave aka the shed we're they can potter around fixing stuff or something don't they?

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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Diamond Dog » 12 Feb 2018, 20:18

OCT wrote:
Diamond Dog wrote:
OCT wrote:The Bowie thing is the Dame in excelsis, isn't it? high-register crooning, overreaching chord changes, super-slick backing vocals. It's something of a showtune really (I guess that was the idea) - and it's preposterously overrated here.


What exactly is an 'over reaching chord change'?


D Bm C#m Gdim
I've nothing much to offer, there's nothing much to take
G D C Bm Em A
I'm an absolute beginner, but I'm absolutely sane
D Bm C#m Gdim
As long as we're together, the rest may go to hell
G D C Bm
I absolutely love you, but we're absolute beginners
G D F# A
With eyes completely open, but nervous all the same


So which particular change are you saying is over reaching John?
“Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.”
"Don't be seduced into thinking that which did not make a profit is without value"
"'Seize the moments as they fly, know to live and learn to die'."

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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Dor-Relip Hotels and Bathings » 12 Feb 2018, 20:22

Go and stick your head up a duck's shitty arse, Pete.
Darkness_Fish wrote:This is a big fucking mess of absolute shit from the off.

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Diamond Dog
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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Diamond Dog » 12 Feb 2018, 20:36

Cogent as always :)
“Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.”
"Don't be seduced into thinking that which did not make a profit is without value"
"'Seize the moments as they fly, know to live and learn to die'."

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Ranking Ted
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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Ranking Ted » 12 Feb 2018, 21:57

Well, this seems to have gone swimmingly.

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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby Dor-Relip Hotels and Bathings » 12 Feb 2018, 22:03

Simpletons tend to derail discussions they can’t understand
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Re: Which Absolute Beginners?

Postby sloopjohnc » 12 Feb 2018, 22:15

The Modernist wrote:I like The Jam single a lot. Its horn driven sound is seen as Weller getting increasingly soul influenced, but actually it was as influenced as much by contemporary singles by the likes of Teardrop Explodes and TV21


Good call out.
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