Musical taste or virtue signalling?

[Purgatory Brite]

I've been called out by the Modernist to defend my statement in the 70s Cup matches that voting for a track from Brazil feels like virtue signalling. Of course, virtue signalling is a euphemism for hypocrisy.

I always been suspicious of those that laud the music of other cultures over their own, in order I suppose to show their erudition and more refined tastes. To claim that tribal or ethnic music from Africa or South America is somehow superior to or more authentic than western popular music always smacks of cultural appropriation. The most obvious example on BCB is when middle-aged,white men endorse the music for Fela Kuti, an artist whose music had resonance as a form political protest in Nigeria in the 70s. It strikes me that those who now praise him do so out of a need for a reflected sense of righteousness or even political correctness. To draw a parallel do we say that Phil Ochs, a more overtly political artist, is a better singer or songwriter than Bob Dylan?

[yomptepi]

Are you calling G a pseud?

I couldn't possibly comment...

[Goat Boy]

Virtue signalling is about exhibiting ones own moral values so I’m quite sure that G is doing that by picking a Brazilian song.

He is a pretentious snob of course. Hang him up by his BCB balls I say!

[BARON CORNY DOG]

I've been called out by the Modernist to defend my statement in the 70s Cup matches that voting for a track from Brazil feels like virtue signalling. Of course, virtue signalling is a euphemism for hypocrisy.

I always been suspicious of those that laud the music of other cultures over their own, in order I suppose to show their erudition and more refined tastes. To claim that tribal or ethnic music from Africa or South America is somehow superior to or more authentic than western popular music always smacks of cultural appropriation. The most obvious example on BCB is when middle-aged,white men endorse the music for Fela Kuti, an artist whose music had resonance as a form political protest in Nigeria in the 70s. It strikes me that those who now praise him do so out of a need for a reflected sense of righteousness or even political correctness. To draw a parallel do we say that Phil Ochs, a more overtly political artist, is a better singer or songwriter than Bob Dylan?

[Purgatory Brite]

Are you calling G a pseud?

To a greater or lesser extent we are all pseuds, particularly those of us that believe that Trout Mask Replica is the musical equivalent of the Sistine Chapel ....

What a liberal statement. I'm disgusted with myself.

[naughty boy]

'virtue signalling' isn't necessarily hypocritical, although it isn't a term anybody would use when praising someone. It's like standing on a metaphorical mountain shouting about workers' rights or something SO THAT EVERYBODY CAN HEAR YOU

Anyway - people can dig Fela's grooves without giving a flying one about his philosophy, right?

Weird post, really. Almost as half-baked as Googa or Jimbo's efforts.

[GoogaMooga]

There would be no point in my virtue signaling. First of all I don't need that acceptance or admiration from my peers. Secondly, it wouldn't change things one iota, for people both here and elsewhere think I am an omnivore. I collect world music, but I don't go out of my way to try music from all corners of the Earth. I have a few regions I care about and that's it. When I try to go beyond that to be even more eclectic, I find I am usually disappointed, not all music is for me. For instance, I bought inuit drum and chant music from Thuie, Greenland, but ended up selling it again, got nothing out of it. The sole reason I bought it was to prove to myself what a clever eclectic one I was.

[fange]

Oh man. Not this crock again.

No, PB. "Suspicious of those that laud the music of other cultures over their own"? Sounds like some kind of McCarthyist scenario, man. Get a grip!

It is definitely possible to enjoy LOTS of different styles of music, and end up liking some of them more than the music you grew up with, without signaling fucking anything apart from the fact that you listen to lots of different music and like some more than others. To say that makes you, by definition, pompous or that you consider your tastes better than others is frankly silly.

[Darkness_Fish]

I'm more offended at the idea that Phil Ochs could possibly be considered a worse singer than Dylan.

[naughty boy]

I'm more offended at the idea that Phil Ochs could possibly be considered a worse singer than Dylan.

'get out the car, Ochs'

[Charlie O.]

Anyway - people can dig Fela's grooves without giving a flying one about his philosophy, right?

Of course. And there are at least a couple of Brazilian albums that are among my very, very favorites. In truth I know fairly little about the country or its culture. I respond to the music.

Weird post, really. Almost as half-baked as Googa or Jimbo's efforts.

Of course.

[Snarfyguy]

It's "woke" one-upmanship and in fact just leveling the accusation amounts to committing the offense.

[The Modernist]

Oh man. Not this crock again.

No, PB. "Suspicious of those that laud the music of other cultures over their own"? Sounds like some kind of McCarthyist scenario, man. Get a grip!

It is definitely possible to enjoy LOTS of different styles of music, and end up liking some of them more than the music you grew up with, without signaling fucking anything apart from the fact that you listen to lots of different music and like some more than others. To say that makes you, by definition, pompous or that you consider your tastes better than others is frankly silly.

I did write a long reply that got lost, but what Fange said basically. Perhaps the biggest fallacy in the original post is the idea that pop music has genres that have a completely separate history and culture to them, whereas in fact pop music has always been about hybridisation. Just look at rock n' roll, a mix of black and white musical forms, and urban and rural.

[BARON CORNY DOG]

I CAN’T BELIEVE that all these people pretend to enjoy the likes of Beethoven, Bach, and Mozart! Austrians and Germans, all of em! And dead for centuries!

You aren’t fooling us!

[Rayge]

I'm more offended at the idea that Phil Ochs could possibly be considered a worse singer than Dylan.

Or indeed a worse songwriter

[naughty boy]

There would be no point in my virtue signaling.

There's no point in ANYONE'S virtue signalling!

Having, or striving for eclectic taste is quite another matter.

[GoogaMooga]

There would be no point in my virtue signaling.

There's no point in ANYONE'S virtue signalling!

Having, or striving for eclectic taste is quite another matter.

To satisfy your curiosity, yes, to impress others, no. That was kind of my point.

[naughty boy]

But 'virtue signalling' is always the latter, never the former

[GoogaMooga]

But 'virtue signalling' is always the latter, never the former

Yes, was that not clear in my first post? If you want to discuss whether there is a point in virtue signaling, then one could argue that some people may stand to gain something by impressing others. Then there would be a point, if only to themselves.

[Count Machuki]

I CAN’T BELIEVE that all these people pretend to enjoy the likes of Beethoven, Bach, and Mozart! Austrians and Germans, all of em! And dead for centuries!

You aren’t fooling us!

Quite. I only listen to middle class white American composers from the South.

#keepingitreal #sowoke