Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

in reality, all of this has been a total load of old bollocks

I prefer....

Jacob
13
33%
Jezzer
27
68%
 
Total votes: 40

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Butch Manly
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Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Butch Manly » 18 Feb 2018, 16:45

The two most popular politicians in Britain right now, I think it's fair to say. And yet, two of the most disliked, also. Who've you got more time for? Please explain why.
Last edited by Butch Manly on 18 Feb 2018, 17:09, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Goat Boy » 18 Feb 2018, 17:02

Stick the pair of 'em in a fucking rocket and blast 'em into space.

As much as I dislike Corbyn that chinless wonder cunt Mogg gives me the total boak.
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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Toby » 18 Feb 2018, 17:14

Rees-Mogg is articulate and candid about his views. I thought his declaration that he didn't believe in abortion in that interview was a brilliant example of how to separate individual perspectives from that of party line or government policy. Compare that with the Liberal nobody that I can't even remember the name of who resigned because he couldn't give a straightforward answer reconciling his faith and party line. I respected him a lot for that - I admire politicians who are not afraid to tell awkward truths.

My concern is that he has little or no government experience.


Corbyn - I admire his tenacity but I can't trust anyone who has said no for 30 years as a politician and refused to compromise. When you get to that age in professional life there is little doubt that you don't change either. He is a competent constituency MP and an excellent campaigner, but someone who champions Chavez in Venezuela and goes on Iranian TV to support their regime can't get anywhere near the reins of power in my eyes.

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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Diamond Dog » 18 Feb 2018, 18:00

Toby wrote:Rees-Mogg is articulate and candid about his views. I thought his declaration that he didn't believe in abortion in that interview was a brilliant example of how to separate individual perspectives from that of party line or government policy. Compare that with the Liberal nobody that I can't even remember the name of who resigned because he couldn't give a straightforward answer reconciling his faith and party line. I respected him a lot for that - I admire politicians who are not afraid to tell awkward truths.

My concern is that he has little or no government experience.


Corbyn - I admire his tenacity but I can't trust anyone who has said no for 30 years as a politician and refused to compromise. When you get to that age in professional life there is little doubt that you don't change either. He is a competent constituency MP and an excellent campaigner, but someone who champions Chavez in Venezuela and goes on Iranian TV to support their regime can't get anywhere near the reins of power in my eyes.



So you admire Rees-Mogg because he refuses to change his views and follow the party line, but can't trust Corbyn because he doesn't compromise?

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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby The Modernist » 18 Feb 2018, 18:09

I don't view Rees-Mogg as a guy with great principles. It's easy to play the role of some home counties sage when you've had everything handed to you on a plate. He knows nothing of ordinary people and their problems, he probably considers such issues beneath him.
Corbyn comes across as very principled and fair and I'd be delighted to see him as Prime Minister.

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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Toby » 18 Feb 2018, 18:10

Brexit is a prime example of how Corbyn obfuscated (and continues to do so) his own individual perspective to the party line. Everyone know he wants Brexit but he doesn't want to because he knows Labour would lose support if it came out and said so. I realise this is all part of politics but with this situation clarity of perspective is required.

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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby The Modernist » 18 Feb 2018, 18:12

Toby wrote:Brexit is a prime example of how Corbyn obfuscated (and continues to do so) his own individual perspective to the party line. Everyone know he wants Brexit but he doesn't want to because he knows Labour would lose support if it came out and said so. I realise this is all part of politics but with this situation clarity of perspective is required.


How about some clarity of perspective from the government?

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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Toby » 18 Feb 2018, 18:15

The Modernist wrote:
Toby wrote:Brexit is a prime example of how Corbyn obfuscated (and continues to do so) his own individual perspective to the party line. Everyone know he wants Brexit but he doesn't want to because he knows Labour would lose support if it came out and said so. I realise this is all part of politics but with this situation clarity of perspective is required.


How about some clarity of perspective from the government?


Rees-Mogg is not a member of the cabinet. There is a significant difference between an MP and someone determining policy.

I agree that the government is being horrendously opaque on the situation.

Rees-Mogg has made it pretty clear that he wants out of the EU..

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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Toby » 18 Feb 2018, 18:17

K wrote:
Toby wrote:Brexit is a prime example of how Corbyn obfuscated (and continues to do so) his own individual perspective to the party line. Everyone know he wants Brexit but he doesn't want to because he knows Labour would lose support if it came out and said so. I realise this is all part of politics but with this situation clarity of perspective is required.

"Everyone knows"


Corbyn belongs to the same school of Bennite thought that didn't want to join the EU. McDonnell too. Why would far left socialists want to be part of it?

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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Butch Manly » 18 Feb 2018, 18:18

Toby's having a mare, here.
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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Toby » 18 Feb 2018, 18:23

Oh I'm on my own but I don't resort to making cheap jibes about the other person. It is classic leftist thought - 'oh look, he doesn't know what he's doing!'

Why don't you just engage with the conversation eh? Have I gone "oh god here come the leftist klaxons with their boring greivance monger arguments rolled out time and time again!"

I could do so, but I don't.

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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby yomptepi » 18 Feb 2018, 18:24

RM seems bemused by all the attention he is getting. He has no ambitions to be leader, and I am sure he will have learned the lessons of the Labour party when it comes to choosing a lame duck candidate in a leadership election. Corbyn seems to have burrowed into a huge political molehill, and now only communicates with his followers by a series of ever more bizarre you tube video's, very much in the style of Big Brother. Of course both are completely unsuited to front line politics. The difference is that RM knows this, whereas Corbyn has let the adulation of a few children turn his head. Pathetic really.
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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Butch Manly » 18 Feb 2018, 18:26

Toby wrote:Corbyn belongs to the same school of Bennite thought that didn't want to join the EU. McDonnell too. Why would far left socialists want to be part of it?


People like me, you mean? Corbyn, like me, has long had grave reservations about the EU but when push came shove he announced himself 70% pro EU (when asked to assign a value). Again, much the same as I. Almost everyone else, of course, was screaming all sorts of scaremongering shite, on both sides.
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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby yomptepi » 18 Feb 2018, 18:28

German Dave wrote:
Toby wrote:Corbyn belongs to the same school of Bennite thought that didn't want to join the EU. McDonnell too. Why would far left socialists want to be part of it?


People like me, you mean? Corbyn, like me, has long had grave reservations about the EU but when push came shove he announced himself 70% pro EU (when asked to assign a value). Again, much the same as I. Almost everyone else, of course, was screaming all sorts of scaremongering shite, on both sides.


Surely Corbyn is against the whole idea of a capitalist construct like the Eu on principal. Certainly he has spent his whole career criticising it as such. The idea that he is 70% in favour is ridiculous,and dishonest.
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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Butch Manly » 18 Feb 2018, 18:30

Toby wrote:Oh I'm on my own but I don't resort to making cheap jibes about the other person. It is classic leftist thought - 'oh look, he doesn't know what he's doing!'

Why don't you just engage with the conversation eh? Have I gone "oh god here come the leftist klaxons with their boring greivance monger arguments rolled out time and time again!"

I could do so, but I don't.


Bloody people with grievances, mongering their bloody grievances. What's their problem?

But no, you're right. I should have taken time to point out the numerous fatuous points and glib analyses you'd so far made.

I'll get back you.
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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Toby » 18 Feb 2018, 18:42

That's absolutely fine. I'm all up for rigorous debate - I just don't think there needs to be any need for lacing political perspectives with personal attacks on the efficacy of the other person.

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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Rayge » 18 Feb 2018, 18:47

Toby wrote:
K wrote:
Toby wrote:Brexit is a prime example of how Corbyn obfuscated (and continues to do so) his own individual perspective to the party line. Everyone know he wants Brexit but he doesn't want to because he knows Labour would lose support if it came out and said so. I realise this is all part of politics but with this situation clarity of perspective is required.

"Everyone knows"


Corbyn belongs to the same school of Bennite thought that didn't want to join the EU. McDonnell too. Why would far left socialists want to be part of it?


K was pointing out a grammatical error in your post
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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Goat Boy » 18 Feb 2018, 18:53

Thank God for that then cos I had no idea what Bleep meant!

(That wasn’t my interpretation)
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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby Samoan » 18 Feb 2018, 18:57

K wrote:...
At least he cares about people.

Corbyn is a seething misanthrope.

I'm Abstaining from voting.
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Re: Rees Mogg or Corbyn?

Postby The Modernist » 18 Feb 2018, 19:05

Samoan wrote:
K wrote:...
At least he cares about people.

Corbyn is a seething misanthrope.
.


Oh dear.