"Emo" and where the Beach Boys fit in...

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Postby The Red Heifer » 25 Feb 2006, 09:03

The9BillionNamesOfGiraffe wrote:
The Red Heifer wrote:Yes a lot of it essentially "OMG MY GIRLFRIEND LEFT ME AND MY HEART IS BEING SHOT WITH A MILLION FIRING ARROWS OF MY BLACKNESS


a bit like an awful lot of blues and soul, then.


Except the singer has a lot of piercings, and so much eye makeup you'd swear he's had the shit kicked out of him before the girl shattered his sunshine fairytale.

But Emo is a soft form musically. You don't want to get into Screamo.
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Postby The Write Profile » 25 Feb 2006, 09:09

A question as to where a group like At the Drive-In fit into this genre. Now, I suppose musically they share some of the traits- the jagged, very agressive "singing style" that Cedric had at the time, the bullish barrage of guitars interpolated with moments of introspection. Yet they seem far more oblique lyrically (something that reached a sort of nadir with the most recent Mars Volta LP where they became so verbose as to be pretentious and farcical), and the wall of agressive seems to pushed against more pysch-friendly passages- there are moments where it sounds like Omar's guitar is going to venture off into a exploratory solo of sorts (again, see later Mars Volta).

There's definitely enough elements of emo in their sound, I suppose, but it seems far too twisted to sit along the majority of the pack. It rocks too hard, for starters.
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Postby The Red Heifer » 25 Feb 2006, 09:17

The Right Summery Profile wrote:A question as to where a group like At the Drive-In fit into this genre. Now, I suppose musically they share some of the traits- the jagged, very agressive "singing style" that Cedric had at the time, the bullish barrage of guitars interpolated with moments of introspection. Yet they seem far more oblique lyrically (something that reached a sort of nadir with the most recent Mars Volta LP where they became so verbose as to be pretentious and farcical), and the wall of agressive seems to pushed against more pysch-friendly passages- there are moments where it sounds like Omar's guitar is going to venture off into a exploratory solo of sorts (again, see later Mars Volta).

There's definitely enough elements of emo in their sound, I suppose, but it seems far too twisted to sit along the majority of the pack. It rocks too hard, for starters.


Maybe not "emo" as such, but I would definitely see them as ancestors of the current hardcore scene, with bands such as Coheed & Cambria, and borderline emo acts such as My Chemical Romance taking cues from ATDI. Maybe if they had a few more navel-gazing lyrics and more heartbreaks from sloppy trollops and we would've seen the ancestors of the Emo scene.

I would probably be a lot more of a fan of Emo, but they can't seem to get the level of personal expression in their lyrics balanced. It's either so upfront and plain as day you feel like you're listening in on a domestic dispute and it makes you cringe, or they try and sound too bookish and wordy and they sound like a pretensious cunt who you can understand why a girl would give them the flick.
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Postby satans favourite son » 25 Feb 2006, 12:19

Jeff K wrote:Fugazi are the godfathers of this type of music. Only they were much better than everything that came after them.

There you have it, emo is watered down Fugazi!


Not really. I think that Rites of Spring is the "original" emo-band, and then they broke up and two of the members of Rites of Spring ended up in Fugazi.

To me emo is music that came out of punk-rock/hardcore, but instead of the angry vocal you get the I'm-almost-crying vocal. So from Rites of Spring in 1986 to today emo has become increasingly watered down. The only thing that kinda remains from the beginning is the I'm-almost-crying vocals.

Anyway... The Rites of Spring record (a collection of everything they recorded) is fucking great.
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Postby satans favourite son » 25 Feb 2006, 12:27

The Red Heifer wrote:
The Right Summery Profile wrote:A question as to where a group like At the Drive-In fit into this genre. Now, I suppose musically they share some of the traits- the jagged, very agressive "singing style" that Cedric had at the time, the bullish barrage of guitars interpolated with moments of introspection. Yet they seem far more oblique lyrically (something that reached a sort of nadir with the most recent Mars Volta LP where they became so verbose as to be pretentious and farcical), and the wall of agressive seems to pushed against more pysch-friendly passages- there are moments where it sounds like Omar's guitar is going to venture off into a exploratory solo of sorts (again, see later Mars Volta).

There's definitely enough elements of emo in their sound, I suppose, but it seems far too twisted to sit along the majority of the pack. It rocks too hard, for starters.


Maybe not "emo" as such, but I would definitely see them as ancestors of the current hardcore scene, with bands such as Coheed & Cambria, and borderline emo acts such as My Chemical Romance taking cues from ATDI. Maybe if they had a few more navel-gazing lyrics and more heartbreaks from sloppy trollops and we would've seen the ancestors of the Emo scene.

I would probably be a lot more of a fan of Emo, but they can't seem to get the level of personal expression in their lyrics balanced. It's either so upfront and plain as day you feel like you're listening in on a domestic dispute and it makes you cringe, or they try and sound too bookish and wordy and they sound like a pretensious cunt who you can understand why a girl would give them the flick.


ATD-I does have a bit of emo in their music, but to me it's the vocals that are important (see above) when deciding what is emo. Coheed & Cambria is kinda emo, but more like emo-prog. My Chemical Romance is boring except for Helena.
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Postby Leg of lamb » 25 Feb 2006, 15:28

Speaking of Rites of Spring, they have one absolutely tremendous song at least - 'Drink Deep', which I came across on the Dischord box (one of the only songs I care for on the whole thing actually). It's not soppy at all and it actually gives that whole straight edge thing a bit of, well, edge. It really does sound like he's caught in the middle of some ethical nuclear war and the path he's chosen is causing him problems ("It's so hard"). Easy to dismiss it with 'he should just get himself laid' but there's more to it than that, in that song at least. I'd agree that most straight edge stuff is humourless, one-dimensional, joyless turd.

I thought that emo was a weird little South Walian cult. Good to see it's global.
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Postby satans favourite son » 25 Feb 2006, 17:11

Leg of lamb wrote:Speaking of Rites of Spring, they have one absolutely tremendous song at least - 'Drink Deep', which I came across on the Dischord box (one of the only songs I care for on the whole thing actually). It's not soppy at all and it actually gives that whole straight edge thing a bit of, well, edge. It really does sound like he's caught in the middle of some ethical nuclear war and the path he's chosen is causing him problems ("It's so hard"). Easy to dismiss it with 'he should just get himself laid' but there's more to it than that, in that song at least. I'd agree that most straight edge stuff is humourless, one-dimensional, joyless turd.


The rest is almost as good as that song. End on End might even be better. The album is definately worth checking out. I also like the Happy Go Licky (same band, different name) tune on the box set.
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Postby harvey k-tel » 25 Feb 2006, 22:35

The9BillionNamesOfGiraffe wrote:i'm still wondering what a moose lodge is.



From http://www.loominfo.org:

The Loyal Order of Moose is a fraternal and service organization founded in 1888, with nearly 1 million men in roughly 2,000 Lodges, in all 50 states and four Canadian provinces, plus Great Britain and Bermuda.

Along with other units of Moose International, the Loyal Order of Moose supports the operation of Mooseheart Child City & School, a 1,000-acre community for children and teens in need, located 40 miles west of Chicago; and Moosehaven, a 63-acre retirement community for its members near Jacksonville, FL. Additionally, Moose Lodges conduct approximately $50 million worth of community service (counting monetary donations and volunteer hours worked) annually.

Additionally, the Loyal Order of Moose conducts numerous sports and recreational programs, in local Lodges and Family Centers, in the majority of 44 State and Provincial Associations, and on a fraternity-wide basis.
       


I actually quite sorry that it's not more exciting.

:)

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Postby bobzilla77 » 16 Aug 2006, 20:31

Harvey K-Tel wrote:
The9BillionNamesOfGiraffe wrote:i'm still wondering what a moose lodge is.



From http://www.loominfo.org:

The Loyal Order of Moose is a fraternal and service organization founded in 1888, with nearly 1 million men in roughly 2,000 Lodges, in all 50 states and four Canadian provinces, plus Great Britain and Bermuda.

Along with other units of Moose International, the Loyal Order of Moose supports the operation of Mooseheart Child City & School, a 1,000-acre community for children and teens in need, located 40 miles west of Chicago; and Moosehaven, a 63-acre retirement community for its members near Jacksonville, FL. Additionally, Moose Lodges conduct approximately $50 million worth of community service (counting monetary donations and volunteer hours worked) annually.

Additionally, the Loyal Order of Moose conducts numerous sports and recreational programs, in local Lodges and Family Centers, in the majority of 44 State and Provincial Associations, and on a fraternity-wide basis.
       


I actually quite sorry that it's not more exciting.

:)



It's hard to understand if yer not from small town America but Elks, Moose, VFW etc halls are one of the only places a kid can actually put on a show. You can't get into bars and the concert halls are too expensive to rent, but if your dad or uncle is in the Elks, he can get you use of the hall for an affordable fee. So ironically these organizations set up around traditional American values ended up sponsoring a lot of punk gigs.

Two 17 year olds came up with $250 and brought my band to the Yuma, AZ Elks Lodge in 1992. We were apparantly the first original band to play in Yuma since anyone could remember. 400 kids showed up, and it was one of the best, most exciting gigs I've ever played. People were genuinely thrilled to have a chance to see live music. Those guys continued booking gigs and several of our LA musician friends went through there on our recommendation. That was as DIY as it gets, making a scene where none existed.

So the misty-eyed remembrance of Moose Lodges has to do with the era when punk rock gigs were homegrown, local events as opposed to mega-events promoted by Clear Channel and sponsored by PepsiCo.
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Postby bobzilla77 » 16 Aug 2006, 20:51

satans favourite son wrote:
Jeff K wrote:Fugazi are the godfathers of this type of music. Only they were much better than everything that came after them.

There you have it, emo is watered down Fugazi!


Not really. I think that Rites of Spring is the "original" emo-band, and then they broke up and two of the members of Rites of Spring ended up in Fugazi.

To me emo is music that came out of punk-rock/hardcore, but instead of the angry vocal you get the I'm-almost-crying vocal. So from Rites of Spring in 1986 to today emo has become increasingly watered down. The only thing that kinda remains from the beginning is the I'm-almost-crying vocals.

Anyway... The Rites of Spring record (a collection of everything they recorded) is fucking great.


When I first heard this term applied to Rites of Spring and Soulside, it was like the bands were so overwhelmed by the emotions they were like, exploding... totally overwhelmed by the intensity of feeling, boiling over and emo-ting with beet red faces and bloody hands. They had the reputation for very frenzied live shows that left people feeling completely reduced.

How that "emo-lved" into a bunch of solipsistic dorks with relationship issues and acoustic guitars is totally beyond me...
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Postby Magilla » 16 Aug 2006, 21:18

Dippy wrote:I've read some sources saying that kind of stuff came from bands like Husker Du, but I don't see it...


I completely agree. A year or so back, a music writer here in NZ published a book about life as a music writer, articles about different genres, etc.
In one he described Husker Du as "emo" and I just about exploded with rage. I e-mailed him and explained that there never was, is or will be any connection between Husker Du and emo. For example, I stated that the word "emo" was not mentioned once in the Husker Du chapter in Our Band Could Be Your Life and in fact, is mentioned only once in the whole book.
I also never saw the word in any articles about Husker Du, even when they were together.
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