BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-50!

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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby Still Baron » 01 Jul 2011, 23:13

Balboa wrote:3. 'Giant Steps' in the Top 10? Well I never! I like it a lot, but it wouldn't make my top 5 Coltrane albums. Having said that, I haven't listened to it for years.


Hell yes! It's second in line behind Love Supreme in my book. Easily.

Balboa wrote:8. No Alice Coltrane? Shame on you BCB! (Actually the vote was split 3 ways - we should have co-ordinated).


She would've made my top 25.

Balboa wrote:10. Baron, I thought long and hard about the Johnny Hartman record - it is a complete favourite of mine, but figured it was a little less jazz and a little more vocal. I kinda wish I had put it in my list now.


I put it on my list with no hesitation.
Actually, I don't go as deep in jazz as some folks here. My list had a bunch of Coltrane and I was a little self conscious about it, but fuck it. My favorites are my favorites.
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby Still Baron » 01 Jul 2011, 23:15

Copehead wrote:Not even one vote for King Oliver.


There's not much between Louis Armstrong and Thelonious Monk, is there.
Proof that Ken Burns wasn't wrong to focus on what he did.
take5_d_shorterer wrote:If John Bonham simply didn't listen to enough Tommy Johnson or Blind Willie Mctell, that's his doing.

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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby Still Baron » 01 Jul 2011, 23:16

1. Thelonious Monk - Genius of Modern Music/Complete Blue Note
2. John Coltrane - A Love Supreme
3. Miles Davis - Bitches Brew
4. John Coltrane - Giant Steps
5. Charlie Parker - Yardbird Suite
6. Miles Davis - In A Silent Way
7. Duke Ellington - Blanton/Webster band
8. Art Tatum - Tatum Solo Masterpieces
9. Horace Silver - Horace Silver & The Jazz Messengers
10. Stan Getz & Charlie Byrd - Jazz Samba
11. John Coltrane - Ole
12. Pharoah Sanders - Karma
13. John Coltrane Coltrane's Sound
14. Ornette Coleman - Shape of Jazz To Come
15. Gerry Mulligan - Gerry Mulligan Quartet (w/Chet Baker)
16. John Coltrane & Johnny Hartman
17. Billie Holiday - Lady in Autumn
18. Andrew Hill - Point of Departure
19. Horace Silver - Song for My Father
20. Pharoah Sanders - Black Unity
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby algroth » 02 Jul 2011, 00:33

Balboa wrote:14. I know there probably isn't enough interest, but it would be fascinating to see this for just the last 10 years of jazz.


As I said, I'd gladly join on that.

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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby Jeff K » 02 Jul 2011, 01:02

Fangedango! wrote:
Jeff K wrote:You guys are going about this the wrong way. You're supposed to be squabbling about the list, not complimenting it.


Man, Jeff, if you had taken a couple of minutes outta your day to drop me even a short list, you could be happily squabbling your brains out right now... ;)


For the record, I was trying to be funny in light of the Pixies controversy and arguing over what is heavy metal and not heavy metal in the previous polls.. Everybody was so civil on this one which was nice to see. Surprisingly, I have quite a few of the albums listed so I wouldn't have felt as out of place as I feared. I've also made a mental note to check out some of the LP's I don't have.
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby Magilla » 02 Jul 2011, 01:20

Here's my top 20. As with the "Best albums of the '80s" thread I voted tactically because I knew that certain albums (which I love just as much as anyone else) would be highly placed without me adding my votes for them.
Also, I wanted some of the more free albums to at least get a placing in the top 50.

1) Albert Ayler - Spiritual Unity.
2) Pharoah Sanders - Black Unity.
3) Pharoah Sanders - Karma.
4) Sun Ra - The Heliocentric World Vol.1
5) Sun Ra - The Heliocentric World Vol.2
6) Ornette Coleman - Free Jazz.
7) Bohren & Der Club Of Gore - Sunset Mission.
8) Alice Coltrane - A Monastic Trio.
9) Archie Shepp - Fire Music.
10) Oliver Nelson - The Blues And The Abstract Truth.
11) Jimmy Smith - Organ Grinder Swing.
12) Roland Kirk - Reeds And Deeds.
13) Wayne Shorter - Juju.
14) Eric Dolphy - Out To Lunch.
15) Nina Simone - Wild Is The Wind.
16) John Coltrane - Ascension.
17) Miles Davis - On The Corner.
18) Sonny Rollins - Alfie.
19) Thelonious Monk - Monk.
20) Keith Jarrett - The Koln Concert.
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby fange » 02 Jul 2011, 01:50

Jeff K wrote:For the record, I was trying to be funny in light of the Pixies controversy and arguing over what is heavy metal and not heavy metal in the previous polls.. Everybody was so civil on this one which was nice to see. Surprisingly, I have quite a few of the albums listed so I wouldn't have felt as out of place as I feared. I've also made a mental note to check out some of the LP's I don't have.



I know, man, i wasn't really having a go at you, or anyone who didn't vote, that'd be stupid. While it woulda been nice to have another 20 or so voters, just so it could practically be called a definitive snapshot of BCBs jazz faves, i still think it's an amazingly telling as well as entertaining list which is batting .500 in my book.

My particular thanks to the little block of voters (neville, comrade and balboa i think) who went for The Windmill Tilter, Love Songs and Mike Taylor Remembered, stuff i have never heard but which i've been actively searching for and enjoying since i got their lists. Great great music.

For better of worse i went with the '1 artist-1 vote' policy, which means my fave Miles album ('Round About Midnight') didn't make the list, but it has been my undeniable fave for too long to ignore. It was one of my first jazz albums, along with Giant Steps, and reminds me of so many important times in my life, both happy and sad, that it is practically part of my DNA make up by now.

I'm kinda sad that only 1 other voter had any Jackie Mac in their list, but that's my only small quibble. Making a list of 20 is so damn hard.

And i really like the idea of making a list of recent jazz faves, maybe like the albums since 1990? That'd be very cool, though i might let someone else take the reins on the next jazz poll if you wanted to do it soon, just to share the fun around... ;)
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby T. Willy Rye » 02 Jul 2011, 01:56

I'm disappointed by the large number of non- Blue Note artists in this list, but what are you gonna do?

Thanks again Ange, for all of your efforts.

Here's mine:

1. Charles Mingus- Black Saint and the Sinner Lady
2. Miles Davis- Kind of Blue
3. John Coltrane- A Love Supreme
4. Sonny Rollins- Saxophone Colossus
5. Kenny Burrell- Midnight Blue
6. Lee Morgan- Tomcat
7. Thelonious Monk- Monk’s Music
8. Grant Green- Solid
9. Stan Getz and Charlie Byrd- Jazz Samba
10. Hank Mobley- Soul Station
11. Nat Adderly- Work Song
12. Horace Silver- Song for My Father
13. Art Blakey and the Jazz Messengers- Moanin’
14. Sonny Clark- Leapin’ and Lopin’
15. Dexter Gordon- Go
16. John Coltrane- Blue Train
17. Big John Patton- Let ’Em Roll
18. Freddie Hubbard- Open Sesame
19. Kenny Dorham- Whistle Stop
20. Kenny Drew- Undercurrent

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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby fange » 02 Jul 2011, 02:22

T. Willy Rye wrote:17. Big John Patton- Let 'Em Roll


You the man.
What is it gonna take to get people to understand the brilliance of this album??
It doesn't help that it's perenially outta print, but this one should be much better known and loved.
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby T. Willy Rye » 02 Jul 2011, 02:57

Fangedango! wrote:
T. Willy Rye wrote:17. Big John Patton- Let 'Em Roll


You the man.
What is it gonna take to get people to understand the brilliance of this album??
It doesn't help that it's perenially outta print, but this one should be much better known and loved.


Don't I know it, brother. I think I've put a BJP track on like 8 consecutive mix club discs.

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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby NMB » 02 Jul 2011, 07:27

Here's mine. I did the one artist one vote thing as well, there were just too many people to get in. Only six of my choices made the top 50 and my highest place choice only made number 7. Oh well.

1. Ah Um - Charles Mingus
2. Monk's Music - Thelonious Monk
3. Africa Brass - John Coltrane
4. Fire Music - Archie Shepp
5. Conference of the Birds - Dave Holland
6. Miles Smiles - Miles Davis
7. Blues and the Abstract Truth - Oliver Nelson
8. Fusion - Jimmy Giuffre
9. Captain Marvel - Stan Getz
10. Ezz-Thetics - George Russell
11. Lola - Zbigniew Namyslovski
12. Ming - David Murray
13. Memorial Album - Clifford Brown
14. Far East Suite - Duke Ellington
15. Three Blind Mice - Art Blakey
16. Way Out West - Sonny Rollins
17. A New Perspective - Donald Byrd
18. Famous 1938 Carnegie Hall Concert - Benny Goodman
19. Black Science - Steve Coleman
20. Jurassic Classics - James Carter
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby WG Kaspar » 02 Jul 2011, 07:30

My list was a bit heavy on the Miles/Coltrane axis, only natural though since I'm still getting to grips with jazz. There's a lot of the listed stuff that's been on my wishlist for ages but they get bypassed time and again. I should remedy this.
I can't really comment bar the few of mine that made the list and as expected they were the popular choices.
One surprise for me is the lack of love for Ornette Coleman's Free Jazz and the absence of vocal jazz, though I only voted for one of those myself.
Anyway top job Ange, really did enjoy this and a lot of stuff to look into.

1. Kind Of blue - Miles Davis
2. A Love Supreme - John Coltrane
3. Free Jazz - Ornette Coleman
4. The black Saint And The Sinner Lady - Charles Mingus
5. On the Corner - Miles Davis
6. Duke Ellington & John Coltrane - Duke Ellington & John Coltrane
7. Giant Steps - John Coltrane
8. Brilliant Corners - Thelonious Monk
9. Mingus Uh Ah - Charles Mingus
10. Out To Lunch - Eric Dolphy
11. Go - Dexter Gordon
12. Big Band Bossa Nova - Quincy Jones
13. The Cole Porter Songbook - Ella Fitzgerald
14. Blue Train - John Coltrane
15. Portraits In Jazz - Bill Evans Trio
16. Cool Struttin' - Sonny Clark
17. Heavy Weather - Weather Report
18. In A Silent Way - Miles Davis
19. The Complete After Midnite Sessions - Nat King Cole Trio
20. Bird & Diz - Charlie Parker & Dizzy Gillespie
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby Copehead » 02 Jul 2011, 12:30

Brer Baron wrote:
Copehead wrote:Not even one vote for King Oliver.


There's not much between Louis Armstrong and Thelonious Monk, is there.
.



There is a theory that the impetus for Be Bop was the whiolesale appropriation of Jazz by white bands who made all the money, hence going somewhere where the white guy didn't have the chops or the commercial need to follow, but that sounds awfully pat.

I prefer early jazz because it was party music rather than listening music, I find much of the later Be Bop stuff that dominates this chart completely soulless, lack of vocal on much of the work doesn't help me either.

Cab Calloway is another outrageous omission, but I suppose that if you have a Jazz albums poll you automatically omit people who were recording on 78 singles so perhaps the lack of people like Ella Fitzgerald and the old New Orleans bands isn't such a suprise.
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby Still Baron » 02 Jul 2011, 14:38

Copehead wrote:
Brer Baron wrote:
Copehead wrote:Not even one vote for King Oliver.


There's not much between Louis Armstrong and Thelonious Monk, is there.
.



There is a theory that the impetus for Be Bop was the whiolesale appropriation of Jazz by white bands who made all the money, hence going somewhere where the white guy didn't have the chops or the commercial need to follow, but that sounds awfully pat.

I prefer early jazz because it was party music rather than listening music, I find much of the later Be Bop stuff that dominates this chart completely soulless, lack of vocal on much of the work doesn't help me either.

Cab Calloway is another outrageous omission, but I suppose that if you have a Jazz albums poll you automatically omit people who were recording on 78 singles so perhaps the lack of people like Ella Fitzgerald and the old New Orleans bands isn't such a suprise.


Well, at least I agree that it's an awfully pat explanation for be bop.
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby Copehead » 02 Jul 2011, 15:41

Brer Baron wrote:Well, at least I agree that it's an awfully pat explanation for be bop.


I think it explains the move by black artists away from "traditional" Jazz, they were forced out to a degree by white artists using the big band template who were more commercially acceptable and malleable for the period and for the men with the money.

But it doesn't really explain why Be Bop/Modern/free Jazz happened happened, it is pat to call a massive cultural phenomenum a simple reaction to the appropriation of big band Jazz by white bands.
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby hookfinger » 02 Jul 2011, 20:25

First off, thanks for compiling this list ange. And now a few thoughts...
If I had to compile a list of my 20 favorite records today, it would be different than it was a week ago. Mainly because it is sometimes very hard to pick you one record out of an artist's catalog. Plus in this week I have discovered a few records that I will play to death for the next few months. As I said my favorites is a list with a revolving door.

When I read things like the next two quotes (and don't take it personally guys), I realize why I don't bother to post so much in the threads. It's like beating your head on the wall.
T. Willy Rye wrote:I'm disappointed by the large number of non- Blue Note artists in this list, but what are you gonna do?

This is equivalent to all The Beatles talk. While I know folks around these parts have open minds, it all seems to roll back onto one subject. Like The Beatles, the Blue Note sessions may be a superb examples of pop, they are not the unattainable pinnacle that some assign them. Did we really just want to see another list of Blue Notes? Don't we know most inside and out by now?

Brer Baron wrote:There's not much between Louis Armstrong and Thelonious Monk, is there.
Proof that Ken Burns wasn't wrong to focus on what he did.

Again, such a dismissal is absurd. There is so much great music in between. But like every other genre of music is seems the pap is what has risen to the top to be remembered. I would be more inclined to say that there was very little groundbreaking going on between Armstrong and Monk. But even then I would be compelled to qualify that statement in a real conversation.
NMB wrote: And I thought there'd be more love for David Murray. But maybe he's too modern. There isn't much (anything?) in the list after the 60s. But what a lot of good music there is in there......

Statements like this and Magilla's hope for more free on the list and even the imminent discussion of jazz of the last decade give me hope.
I could easily have included David Murray on my list. There are quite a few on other peoples lists that I though "If only I had a bigger list". I think a lot of people might think that. If I were to compile a list of the 500 greatest jazz lps, I would still agonize at what would fall below 501.

For the record here is my list...
Hot Fives sessions - Louis Armstrong
Original 1945 Bebop Sessions - Dizzy Gillespie/Charlie Parker
Mingus Mingus Mingus - Charles Mingus
Monk's Music - Thelonious Monk
Somalia - Billy Harper
Free At Last - Mal Waldron
Of Blues and Dreams - Anthony Davis
Bob's Pink Cadillac - William Parker Clarinet Trio
Smack Up - Art Pepper
You Know The Number - Henry Threadgill
Blues and Abstract Truth - Oliver Nelson
Light Blue - Arthur Blythe
Stick Up - Bobby Hutcherson
Changing Seasons - Billy Bang
Another kind Of Groove - Kahil El Zabar
Today and Now - Coleman Hawkins
Capricorn Moon - Marion Brown
Indo Pak Coaltition - Rudresh Mahanthappi
Lady Time - Ella Fitzgerald
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby Still Baron » 02 Jul 2011, 21:55

hookfinger wrote:
Brer Baron wrote:There's not much between Louis Armstrong and Thelonious Monk, is there.
Proof that Ken Burns wasn't wrong to focus on what he did.

Again, such a dismissal is absurd. There is so much great music in between. But like every other genre of music is seems the pap is what has risen to the top to be remembered. I would be more inclined to say that there was very little groundbreaking going on between Armstrong and Monk. But even then I would be compelled to qualify that statement in a real conversation.


I suspect you misunderstood my point.

Which was that the BCB list has Louis Armstrong and then not much of a peep until Monk and then the usual hard bop.

Which is why I don't think it was bad for Burns to focus so much on pre-WWII and be-bop in exchange for possibly giving fusion and more avant/modern stuff the short shrift.

If this is what you got out of my post the first go-round, apologies. I misunderstood, I guess.
Last edited by Still Baron on 02 Jul 2011, 22:46, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby geoffcowgill » 02 Jul 2011, 22:20

I limited myself quite a bit so as not to put any compilations. But having done that, I ended up feeling kind of bad that I'd left out a few favorite performers. Oh, well.

My jazz collection is surely nowhere near most of the people who voted in this poll (I've probably got about 200 discs), and some of the universally acknowledged greats I simply haven't heard yet (Out to Lunch being one of the prime examples). I was kind of surprised that I was the only one who voted for a few of these, though.

1-Miles Davis - Kind Of Blue
2-Charles Mingus - Mingus Ah Um
3-Duke Ellington - Money Jungle
4-John Coltrane - Giant Steps
5-Horace Silver - The Cape Verdean Blues
6-Art Blakey & Jazz Messengers - A Night In Tunisia
7-Ornette Coleman - The Shape Of Jazz To Come
8-John Coltrane - Coltrane (on Impulse)
9-Sonny Rollins - Saxophone Colossus
10-Charles Mingus - The Black Saint and the Sinner Lady
11-Herbie Hancock - Fat Albert Rotunda
12-Mose Allison - I Don't Worry About A Thing
13-Dave Brubeck Quartet - Time Out
14-Freddy Hubbard - Red Clay
15-Hoagy Carmichael - Hoagy Sings Carmichael
16-Ella Fitzgerald & Louis Armstrong - Ella & Louis
17-Grant Green - Grant's First Stand
18-Thelonious Monk - Criss-Cross
19-Miles Davis - Workin' With The Miles Davis Quintet
20-Oliver Nelson & Eric Dolphy - Straight Ahead
Last edited by geoffcowgill on 02 Jul 2011, 23:06, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby Balboa » 02 Jul 2011, 22:40

hookfinger wrote:Like The Beatles, the Blue Note sessions may be a superb examples of pop, they are not the unattainable pinnacle that some assign them. Did we really just want to see another list of Blue Notes? Don't we know most inside and out by now?


I count about 16 of the Top 50 as BN titles, not even close to being the majority of titles in there. I'm not sure if I am misreading your post, but are you suggesting that there was some blinkered BN voting? I just don't see it.

In fact, that is what is so great about the list(s), there are a whole bunch of different labels and styles represented in there.

And whilst I agree that great jazz does not just exist at Blue Note, there are some unbelievable sessions there, as good as any other jazz label. Again, maybe I am getting you wrong, but BN isn't just a 'pop' label, right?

I think the thing with BN is that it is like some kinda family tree and it is easy to get lost in that revolving cast of players. You're right though, there is plenty of life to be had outside of it!
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Re: BCB's Favourite Jazz Albums Poll 2011 - The Results, 1-5

Postby hookfinger » 03 Jul 2011, 03:38

Brer Baron wrote:I suspect you misunderstood my point.
Which was that the BCB list has Louis Armstrong and then not much of a peep until Monk and then the usual hard bop.
Which is why I don't think it was bad for Burns to focus so much on pre-WWII and be-bop in exchange for possibly giving fusion and more avant/modern stuff the short shrift.


It is I who must apologize because I indeed misunderstood your point. Perhaps I am not familiar enough with the Burns doc. I completely thought you were dismissing the era between Armstrong and Monk. Just the same I think that is often the common thought amongst some posters.

Balboa wrote:
I count about 16 of the Top 50 as BN titles, not even close to being the majority of titles in there. I'm not sure if I am misreading your post, but are you suggesting that there was some blinkered BN voting? I just don't see it.

In fact, that is what is so great about the list(s), there are a whole bunch of different labels and styles represented in there.

And whilst I agree that great jazz does not just exist at Blue Note, there are some unbelievable sessions there, as good as any other jazz label. Again, maybe I am getting you wrong, but BN isn't just a 'pop' label, right?

I think the thing with BN is that it is like some kinda family tree and it is easy to get lost in that revolving cast of players. You're right though, there is plenty of life to be had outside of it!


I am not suggesting any sort of conspiracy voting towards BN if that is what you mean. But 16 out of 50 does constitute a majority. Without doing the math I suspect no other label came in even close.
Nor am I suggesting that BN is a pop label, I only compared it to The Beatles because oftimes around here they are considered the mountaintop to which all else pales. I refute that.

I grew up with the BNs. I love them still. But I think that with BN, you know ahead of time exactly what you are gonna get. Great ensemble recordings that have been scrubbed free of any of the imperfections that make improvised music so much fun. Not just in the performances but the recordings themselves. At least by the time you hit all those 50's sessions.
I guess when I see too many BN's in the NP parts of the thread, I wonder why every one can't be as enlightened as me. ;)
Last edited by hookfinger on 03 Jul 2011, 03:38, edited 1 time in total.
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