Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Tapiocahead » 18 Feb 2009, 18:17

Dr Modernist wrote:
Sir John Coan wrote:Hm. Still, hardly flying the flag, are yez?


I think there is a conservative streak in many of the British contributors to the cup, in contrast to many of the American contributors who look for a whole range of music from blues, soul and jazz to the outer reaches of psych to the personal vision of some outsider singer-songwriter. On the other hand many of the British voters would vote quite happily for a list comprised of 10 uk bands who released records between 1978 and 1988.
In that sense I would say they've recorded a pretty phyrric victory.


Been knocked out eh?
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Neil Jung » 18 Feb 2009, 19:23

Tapiocahead wrote:
Dr Modernist wrote:
Sir John Coan wrote:Hm. Still, hardly flying the flag, are yez?


I think there is a conservative streak in many of the British contributors to the cup, in contrast to many of the American contributors who look for a whole range of music from blues, soul and jazz to the outer reaches of psych to the personal vision of some outsider singer-songwriter. On the other hand many of the British voters would vote quite happily for a list comprised of 10 uk bands who released records between 1978 and 1988.
In that sense I would say they've recorded a pretty phyrric victory.


Been knocked out eh?


:D :lol: :lol: :roll:
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby The Red Nosed Heifer » 20 Feb 2009, 13:03

Just to continue the nationalistic thing, there's 2 more Sydneysiders in the comp than (born in, just to fuck with Jeff) Americans :D
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Balboa » 21 Feb 2009, 21:37

I think I am the biggest loser so far (can this be confirmed?).

Show some respect.
Of course, I was mostly stoned at the time.

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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby James R » 22 Feb 2009, 13:17

Balboa wrote:I think I am the biggest loser so far (can this be confirmed?).

Show some respect.


No.
Bugger off.
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 23 Feb 2009, 21:01

You know...I gotta agree with the taste brigade a bit. The lists that have survived to the current rounds seem a lot weaker than the ones that are gone.

All pretense about "adventurousness" aside - voters just seem to be letting weaker music through. I'm not sure I have it in me to create a list mediocre enough to ever really compete for this thing.
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby The Modernist » 23 Feb 2009, 21:17

Davey the Fat Boy wrote:You know...I gotta agree with the taste brigade a bit. The lists that have survived to the current rounds seem a lot weaker than the ones that are gone.

All pretense about "adventurousness" aside - voters just seem to be letting weaker music through. I'm not sure I have it in me to create a list mediocre enough to ever really compete for this thing.


It partly the way the draw's gone this year. It reminds me of last year's FA cup ( a comparison totally lost on an American nonewithstanding) when the big clubs met each other early on and knocked each other out allowing small, unfancied clubs to make it to the far reaches of the competition. There are still some very good lists left in, but there's quite a few which are very fortunate to have got this far.

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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Butch Manly » 23 Feb 2009, 21:39

Davey the Fat Boy wrote: I'm not sure I have it in me to create a list mediocre enough to ever really compete for this thing.


You did pretty well two years ago.
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby The Modernist » 23 Feb 2009, 21:41

I never did really recriminate. Now with such mediocrity in round three might be an apposite time to do so.
First of all it was no disgrace to lose to such a good list, no what was disappointing was the lack of interest in some of my most enterprising of selections. Only Hatz and Penk really bothered to check out some of my picks, so I must first of all thank them for making some complimentary comments. As for the rest of you (people who voted for me are excluded from this obviously)..whether it was a failure of imagination, a poverty of taste or just sheer laziness I don't know. But I will highlight five tracks from my fifteen to say more about what you missed or foolishly decided to ignore.
Drove By The Place ( I Used To Stay) - David Ruffin
This was an adventurous pick in many ways because it highlights a side of soul that traditionally BCB has little time for: that of a lush and heavily orchestrated 70's soul with huge arrangements and a distinct sentimentality. Actually the first few times I heard it it was a bit too much for me, but then the sinewy melody and the aching perfection of the vocal took hold. I love the triumphant arrangement with its affirming horn blasts that seem to signify a defiance within its nostalgic sadness. A powerful, emotive record.
One More Heartache -Marvin Gaye
Masked Man suggested this was a selection done more for obscurity sake. On the contrary, as The Right Profile astutely noted, this has long been a hidden gem in Marvin's catalogue. Put simply this is a masterpiece of raw, direct r n'b. With its lean arrangement and spiky guitar, this is a much tougher sound than you'd usually associate with Motown.
He's My Love -Kim Weston
Another track which was inexplicably ignored. Had you bothered downloading this (and there is still time so do it) you would have heard one of the most majestic slices of arranged country soul you could ever wish to hear. A beautiful, yearning track that begins delicately but builds into a pure, expressive outpouring of emotion. The best track on my list and as good as anything picked in the competition.
Too Sad To Tell- Debbie Taylor
A triumph of raw, blistering funk with scorching hammond and a ballsy vocal. Exciting as hell.
Until Tomorrow - Terry Callier
A sweeping, huge song which never loses its sense of personal intimacy. Cadet were wonderful at these sophisticated but very natural arrangements. The way this builds with its cascading strings and Callier's rich baritone riding over it like a man inspired is a magical thing indeed.

Of course I've just highlighted some of the soul tracks that were mainly ignored, there is much more to my list than this, but that's what you missed. Have an other listen. And no its not sour grapes, I just don't want anyone to miss out on this wonderful music.

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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 23 Feb 2009, 21:58

That Bloody Giraffe wrote:
Davey the Fat Boy wrote: I'm not sure I have it in me to create a list mediocre enough to ever really compete for this thing.


You did pretty well two years ago.


I don't think that same list would get out of the first round these days.
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 23 Feb 2009, 22:02

Dr Modernist wrote:First of all it was no disgrace to lose to such a good list


FWIW - I thought that match-up was the single toughest choice I had to make in the entire cup. If you wer ematched against any other list you would have likely won my vote.

And thanks for turning me on to that Kim Weston track. It is indeed marvelous.
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Jumper k » 24 Feb 2009, 09:40

Dr Modernist wrote:I never did really recriminate. Now with such mediocrity in round three might be an apposite time to do so.
First of all it was no disgrace to lose to such a good list, no what was disappointing was the lack of interest in some of my most enterprising of selections. Only Hatz and Penk really bothered to check out some of my picks, so I must first of all thank them for making some complimentary comments. As for the rest of you (people who voted for me are excluded from this obviously)..whether it was a failure of imagination, a poverty of taste or just sheer laziness I don't know. But I will highlight five tracks from my fifteen to say more about what you missed or foolishly decided to ignore.
Drove By The Place ( I Used To Stay) - David Ruffin
This was an adventurous pick in many ways because it highlights a side of soul that traditionally BCB has little time for: that of a lush and heavily orchestrated 70's soul with huge arrangements and a distinct sentimentality. Actually the first few times I heard it it was a bit too much for me, but then the sinewy melody and the aching perfection of the vocal took hold. I love the triumphant arrangement with its affirming horn blasts that seem to signify a defiance within its nostalgic sadness. A powerful, emotive record.
One More Heartache -Marvin Gaye
Masked Man suggested this was a selection done more for obscurity sake. On the contrary, as The Right Profile astutely noted, this has long been a hidden gem in Marvin's catalogue. Put simply this is a masterpiece of raw, direct r n'b. With its lean arrangement and spiky guitar, this is a much tougher sound than you'd usually associate with Motown.
He's My Love -Kim Weston
Another track which was inexplicably ignored. Had you bothered downloading this (and there is still time so do it) you would have heard one of the most majestic slices of arranged country soul you could ever wish to hear. A beautiful, yearning track that begins delicately but builds into a pure, expressive outpouring of emotion. The best track on my list and as good as anything picked in the competition.
Too Sad To Tell- Debbie Taylor
A triumph of raw, blistering funk with scorching hammond and a ballsy vocal. Exciting as hell.
Until Tomorrow - Terry Callier
A sweeping, huge song which never loses its sense of personal intimacy. Cadet were wonderful at these sophisticated but very natural arrangements. The way this builds with its cascading strings and Callier's rich baritone riding over it like a man inspired is a magical thing indeed.

Of course I've just highlighted some of the soul tracks that were mainly ignored, there is much more to my list than this, but that's what you missed. Have an other listen. And no its not sour grapes, I just don't want anyone to miss out on this wonderful music.

Bit too obscure really, G.

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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby never/ever » 24 Feb 2009, 10:07

.
Last edited by never/ever on 25 Feb 2009, 08:07, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Balboa » 24 Feb 2009, 21:12

So, do people put up lists of songs they like, or lists of songs they think can win (even if they don't like them)?

I can't reconcile some lists to the posters - or at least to the stuff they post about in YY.
Of course, I was mostly stoned at the time.

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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Bad Ambassador » 24 Feb 2009, 21:19

Well, I can only vouch for my list, but it's all stuff I like.

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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Butch Manly » 24 Feb 2009, 21:49

Balboa wrote:So, do people put up lists of songs they like, or lists of songs they think can win (even if they don't like them)?


I've never put up a song that I didn't love but I've thought twice about a few songs that I thought may get a negative reaction, I suppose. When I won two years ago I was praised for brave or idiosyncratic choices and damned for being safe and predictable. :roll:
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby toomanyhatz » 24 Feb 2009, 21:59

Balboa wrote:So, do people put up lists of songs they like, or lists of songs they think can win (even if they don't like them)?

I can't reconcile some lists to the posters - or at least to the stuff they post about in YY.


It's somewhere in between for me. I'd never use anything I didn't at least like a great deal, but it's not simply a matter of ten songs I love. As I said at the time, I used the Associates, even though I only like them a great deal, rather than love them, because I thought it was a good example of the kind of thing (eccentric 80s pop) that BCB likes but was missing from my list.

Fat lot of good it did me anyway, of course. :evil:
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Neil Jung » 24 Feb 2009, 22:09

I'm only using songs that I both own and love.
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Tapiocahead » 24 Feb 2009, 23:06

It's not about the songs you include anyhow, it's about the ones you leave out.
I can guarantee that I love all the songs in my list, however I love other songs equally that I won't include because I know it's a ticket to oblivion and I won't get praised for my brave and idiosyncratic choices by including Metallica or Dolly Parton or My Sharona - I'll just get knocked out and I speak from experience.
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Re: Bitter Recriminations 2009 - Now Bitterer Than Ever!

Postby Matty Red Sox » 25 Feb 2009, 02:25

Tapiocahead wrote:It's not about the songs you include anyhow, it's about the ones you leave out.
I can guarantee that I love all the songs in my list, however I love other songs equally that I won't include because I know it's a ticket to oblivion and I won't get praised for my brave and idiosyncratic choices by including Metallica or Dolly Parton or My Sharona - I'll just get knocked out and I speak from experience.

True, I think that my Yes choice and Ram Jam knocked me out...still I love both songs.
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