Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

in reality, all of this has been a total load of old bollocks
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Dr Markus
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Dr Markus » 12 Feb 2018, 19:22

So Eire is gonna win the lot then? Aye thought so.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 12 Feb 2018, 19:26

The Great Defector wrote:So Eire is gonna win the lot then? Aye thought so.


Fraid not, they don’t even play rugby
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Dr Markus » 12 Feb 2018, 19:27

Copehead wrote:
The Great Defector wrote:So Eire is gonna win the lot then? Aye thought so.


Fraid not, they don’t even play rugby


Meh, not really bothered.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 12 Feb 2018, 19:29

The Great Defector wrote:
Copehead wrote:
The Great Defector wrote:So Eire is gonna win the lot then? Aye thought so.


Fraid not, they don’t even play rugby


Meh, not really bothered.


Neither are Eire
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby The Modernist » 12 Feb 2018, 23:26

Copehead wrote:
The Modernist wrote:When are they going to sort out the rules for the scrum btw? I can't think of any other set piece in any other sport that so often ends up in an unresolved mess. It's ridiculous when you think about it. And it slows the game right up
w

Well it isn’t really is it, it is 16 men pushing as hard as they can at a low angle, of course things are going to happen

.


More accurately it is 16 men beginning to push as hard as they can, the referee blowing his whistle so he can talk to the captain or the hooker, 16 men beginning to push as hard as they can AGAIN, the referee blowing his whistle AGAIN, talking to the players some more, the players getting down to scrum AGAIN, the referee blowing his whistle again AGAIN...

It's nothing to do with not liking the idea of scrums, it's a dislike of them seemingly never working! I think they have too many laws surrounding scrummaging these days so it seems there's always an infringement somewhere. It needs to be simplified.

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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 13 Feb 2018, 18:45

The Modernist wrote:
Copehead wrote:
The Modernist wrote:When are they going to sort out the rules for the scrum btw? I can't think of any other set piece in any other sport that so often ends up in an unresolved mess. It's ridiculous when you think about it. And it slows the game right up
w

Well it isn’t really is it, it is 16 men pushing as hard as they can at a low angle, of course things are going to happen

.


More accurately it is 16 men beginning to push as hard as they can, the referee blowing his whistle so he can talk to the captain or the hooker, 16 men beginning to push as hard as they can AGAIN, the referee blowing his whistle AGAIN, talking to the players some more, the players getting down to scrum AGAIN, the referee blowing his whistle again AGAIN...

It's nothing to do with not liking the idea of scrums, it's a dislike of them seemingly never working! I think they have too many laws surrounding scrummaging these days so it seems there's always an infringement somewhere. It needs to be simplified.


I think you have rather over egged your original point

3 years ago when the hit was allowed then this happened, multiple collapses, usually penalties, the vast majority of scrums these days lead directly to the ball coming back into play

You are fighting a battle that was resolved 2-3 year ago but you haven’t noticed that the problem is practically nonexistent these days

Watch England Wales count the number of scrums, the number of resets and the number of penalties

You may be surprised
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby The Modernist » 13 Feb 2018, 18:59

There were several instances of it in the France Scotland match.

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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 13 Feb 2018, 19:12

The Modernist wrote:There were several instances of it in the France Scotland match.

Probably I wasn’t watching closely
But it is no where near the problem of 3 years ago
I think there was one reset in the England Wales game
If both team want to use the scrum as a restart now it just happens, like the old days
If one team, or both, want to play silly buggers it is probably possible, but that is rare now, an refs husially have a low tolerance for it.

3 yeas ago I would have agreed with you, despite being an ex front row forward, but now I think the problem is more or less gone.

To be honest it never existed below the elite level because they simply didn’t have the size and strength of prop to hit like that, it was spectacular sometimes but most of the time it was a bore and it killed proper propping and hooking for a number of years, I am glad all of that is back now.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Nikki Gradual » 14 Feb 2018, 14:16

This is clearly going to overshadow the entire championship and could go on for years. What a shame.
I'm not saying people should let it lie if an injustice has been done, simply that the after effects are going to ruin the season.
Would it be any different if the try had been given and then it emerged that it was more likely that it wasn't scored? No, it would be exactly the same. It makes me hanker for simpler times.

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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Nikki Gradual » 14 Feb 2018, 14:22

Copehead wrote:
The Modernist wrote:There were several instances of it in the France Scotland match.

Probably I wasn’t watching closely
But it is no where near the problem of 3 years ago
I think there was one reset in the England Wales game
If both team want to use the scrum as a restart now it just happens, like the old days
If one team, or both, want to play silly buggers it is probably possible, but that is rare now, an refs husially have a low tolerance for it.

3 yeas ago I would have agreed with you, despite being an ex front row forward, but now I think the problem is more or less gone.

To be honest it never existed below the elite level because they simply didn’t have the size and strength of prop to hit like that, it was spectacular sometimes but most of the time it was a bore and it killed proper propping and hooking for a number of years, I am glad all of that is back now.


I can understand totally that the scrum has become tedious to spectators, especially if they do know what it is like on the inside of it (pref the tight five obvs), but I still revel in what is to me a magnificent gladiatorial battle.
As Copey says, the problem is that since professionalism the players have become so big and strong that it really is a very dangerous place to be and, at international level at least, neck and spinal injuries would be happening all the time if it wasn't extremely closely policed. And sadly that is dull to watch.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby The Modernist » 14 Feb 2018, 14:28

Copehead wrote:
The Modernist wrote:There were several instances of it in the France Scotland match.

Probably I wasn’t watching closely
But it is no where near the problem of 3 years ago
I think there was one reset in the England Wales game
If both team want to use the scrum as a restart now it just happens, like the old days
If one team, or both, want to play silly buggers it is probably possible, but that is rare now, an refs husially have a low tolerance for it.

3 yeas ago I would have agreed with you, despite being an ex front row forward, but now I think the problem is more or less gone.

To be honest it never existed below the elite level because they simply didn’t have the size and strength of prop to hit like that, it was spectacular sometimes but most of the time it was a bore and it killed proper propping and hooking for a number of years, I am glad all of that is back now.


Thanks for that. Good point -well made.

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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Geezee » 14 Feb 2018, 14:31

Nikki Gradual wrote:This is clearly going to overshadow the entire championship and could go on for years. What a shame.
I'm not saying people should let it lie if an injustice has been done, simply that the after effects are going to ruin the season.
Would it be any different if the try had been given and then it emerged that it was more likely that it wasn't scored? No, it would be exactly the same. It makes me hanker for simpler times.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/43046791


Is it? I think it's done, dusted, and over with. What else is there to say about it?
Jones is being an utter fool over the issue, but I suppose you'd expect it from England's coach. If a mistake has been made, why on earth not discuss it? The very fact that TMOs exist to begin with is because there were so many instances where it was obvious that TVs could capture things that elite referees would miss. If they'd just let mistakes happen "oh the game is over so we just have to live with it" then there'd be no incentive to improve the game. I accept that many people don't like TMOs etc or prefer "simpler times" or whatever but personally I think they work, and what happened over the weekend was an utter fkc-up. But that's all it was, and I don't see any overreaction or that it risks "ruining" any season. Gatland made his point, but he didn't ask for any investigation, wasn't up in arms about it or harping on about it, the admission of error was self-prompted and (in my opinion) very admirable, and it seems to me at least Wales have immediately moved on and, indeed, "lived with it".
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Nikki Gradual » 14 Feb 2018, 16:02

Geezee wrote:
Nikki Gradual wrote:This is clearly going to overshadow the entire championship and could go on for years. What a shame.
I'm not saying people should let it lie if an injustice has been done, simply that the after effects are going to ruin the season.
Would it be any different if the try had been given and then it emerged that it was more likely that it wasn't scored? No, it would be exactly the same. It makes me hanker for simpler times.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/43046791


Is it? I think it's done, dusted, and over with. What else is there to say about it?
Jones is being an utter fool over the issue, but I suppose you'd expect it from England's coach. If a mistake has been made, why on earth not discuss it? The very fact that TMOs exist to begin with is because there were so many instances where it was obvious that TVs could capture things that elite referees would miss. If they'd just let mistakes happen "oh the game is over so we just have to live with it" then there'd be no incentive to improve the game. I accept that many people don't like TMOs etc or prefer "simpler times" or whatever but personally I think they work, and what happened over the weekend was an utter fkc-up. But that's all it was, and I don't see any overreaction or that it risks "ruining" any season. Gatland made his point, but he didn't ask for any investigation, wasn't up in arms about it or harping on about it, the admission of error was self-prompted and (in my opinion) very admirable, and it seems to me at least Wales have immediately moved on and, indeed, "lived with it".


We'll see. ;)
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 14 Feb 2018, 21:46

Nikki Gradual wrote:This is clearly going to overshadow the entire championship and could go on for years. What a shame.
I'm not saying people should let it lie if an injustice has been done, simply that the after effects are going to ruin the season.
Would it be any different if the try had been given and then it emerged that it was more likely that it wasn't scored? No, it would be exactly the same. It makes me hanker for simpler times.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/43046791


I doubt it, World Rugby acknowledged it was a bad call, I think that is the end of it, most Welsh fans realise they were second best for most of that match and the better side won, the result is fair.

I think people just wanted an aknowledgement that that call was ridiculous, everyone could see it was a try
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 14 Feb 2018, 21:51

Geezee wrote:
Nikki Gradual wrote:This is clearly going to overshadow the entire championship and could go on for years. What a shame.
I'm not saying people should let it lie if an injustice has been done, simply that the after effects are going to ruin the season.
Would it be any different if the try had been given and then it emerged that it was more likely that it wasn't scored? No, it would be exactly the same. It makes me hanker for simpler times.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/43046791


Is it? I think it's done, dusted, and over with. What else is there to say about it?
Jones is being an utter fool over the issue, but I suppose you'd expect it from England's coach. If a mistake has been made, why on earth not discuss it? The very fact that TMOs exist to begin with is because there were so many instances where it was obvious that TVs could capture things that elite referees would miss. If they'd just let mistakes happen "oh the game is over so we just have to live with it" then there'd be no incentive to improve the game. I accept that many people don't like TMOs etc or prefer "simpler times" or whatever but personally I think they work, and what happened over the weekend was an utter fkc-up. But that's all it was, and I don't see any overreaction or that it risks "ruining" any season. Gatland made his point, but he didn't ask for any investigation, wasn't up in arms about it or harping on about it, the admission of error was self-prompted and (in my opinion) very admirable, and it seems to me at least Wales have immediately moved on and, indeed, "lived with it".


Without a TMO the try would never have been given because it looks like Watson was there ahead of Anscombe, it was just poor technique from him that meant Anscombe got to,the ball first

It was the sort of try that has only become possible because of TMOs, this one just naused it up

I think every one in the Welsh team just wanted that acknowledged

I think the vast majority of Welsh fans likewise just wanted acknow.edgement of an error

I still think the better side on the day won
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Deebank » 24 Feb 2018, 17:33

Oh flower of Scotland!
I've been talking about writing a book - 25 years of TEFL - for a few years now. I've got it in me.

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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Deebank » 24 Feb 2018, 18:42

Well that more than made up for Wales’s narrow defeat in Dublin. Always a pleasure to see England outclassed - especially by Scotland!
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 24 Feb 2018, 22:36

Sometimes I am glad I can't watch the rugby today would have been a day of crappy disappointment all round.
I would rather England beat Scotland than vice versa.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby The Modernist » 24 Feb 2018, 23:25

I wouldn't!

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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 25 Feb 2018, 02:04

The Modernist wrote:I wouldn't!


I am a bit of an odd Welsh fan in that England are my second favourite team

I doubt were are a large group

Wales, England, Scotland, Italy, Argentina, France, Ireland, South Africa, Australia, New Zealand

for the 2 major international championships.
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