Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

in reality, all of this has been a total load of old bollocks
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 13 Feb 2017, 00:09

andymacandy wrote:
Copehead wrote:
Nikki Gradual wrote:. Wales to win a horribly ugly encounter by two clear scores I reckon..


To lose a fantastic encounter by less than a score in the end.

But what a try to lose it to.

Biggar should have put that out but still

A great advert for rugby, a stirring of hope for the Lions with players like that available, but sadly the wrong result.

Jonathan Davies, I think, but I feel for him- one mistake under immense and sustained pressure, and the game was gone.
I watched as a (mostly) neutral, and it was a classic NH game.I had thought we might sneak a win against England or Wales this time around, but I dont see it now. They are both on a new level.

One question- why did Wales not get penalised for crossing when they scored? It was a great set piece, but Im sure the Welsh centre crossed in front Williams as he went for the posts.


You are right JDII with Sinckler putting on huge pressure. But the whole game they had been kicking long not out as a tactic and I think it was just too ingrained that they kicked in field, but that one needed to go out to give them time to pause and regroup and there would only have been 2-3 minutes left to hold out. It was an inability to adapt rather than an inability to find touch, it would have been easier to find touch and the ball didn't appear to have been miskicked.

I haven't seen the Welsh try except a grainy clip but I don't think the Welsh dummy runner is ahead of the players passing and receiving and he isn't blocking a tackler just holding them by putting doubt in their mind, no English player was physically blocked from making the tackle as far as I can see. I will look at it again when I get home.

I think all the NH teams are going up levels this year bar Italy. They are all pushing on, Everyone thought Wales had stalled but that proved they hadn't they matched England and the game could have gone either way with no complaints, England are just in that happy place where winning becomes a habit and no one panics, only very good teams make it to that place.

Scotland are certainly better, France are as well although they are still relying on bullying teams up front that will not work against the very best. Ireland are pushing on as well although they may be the other team who have stalled a bit, it may be time to move on from Sexton, and their back 3 isn't looking the most threatening.

But NH rugby is in a better place than SH rugby at the moment and few would have thought that a year ago.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 13 Feb 2017, 00:14

andymacandy wrote:
andymacandy wrote:Right, this weekend.
A stung Ireland to thump a disheartened Italy
England to improve and narrowly beat Wales.
France to push Scotland all over the park, while we try to run around the outside, France to win a high scoring game.
I imagine the result will depend on how the ref runs the scrum, as France are huge and powerful and would be daft not to use the maul at every opportunity.

Well, I can't say we were unlucky, other than to lose so many critical players to injury.
I have often worried about how reliant we are on Laidlaw, but Price did a decent job when he came on, and will be fine when he learns to calm down.


It highlighted Scotland's major problem now, lack of strength in depth in key positions.

Front row looks OK as this is already a 2/3 string but they really need Nel back, second row is OK but old as back up to the Greys, in fact the whole pack is OK as are centers but 9,10 15 looks weak from the bench.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Geezee » 13 Feb 2017, 09:20

Nikki Gradual wrote:
andymacandy wrote:One question- why did Wales not get penalised for crossing when they scored? It was a great set piece, but Im sure the Welsh centre crossed in front Williams as he went for the posts.


I thought that too, but let it go. I can no longer tell the difference between what are considered legitimate dummy runners and decoys and blocking or crossing.


You can decoy but you can't take an opposing man out of his ability to tackle the man with the ball (ie by crossing in front of him, running into him) - that didn't happen here, it was just a pure dummy run.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Geezee » 13 Feb 2017, 09:41

Copehead wrote:
andymacandy wrote:
andymacandy wrote:Right, this weekend.
A stung Ireland to thump a disheartened Italy
England to improve and narrowly beat Wales.
France to push Scotland all over the park, while we try to run around the outside, France to win a high scoring game.
I imagine the result will depend on how the ref runs the scrum, as France are huge and powerful and would be daft not to use the maul at every opportunity.

Well, I can't say we were unlucky, other than to lose so many critical players to injury.
I have often worried about how reliant we are on Laidlaw, but Price did a decent job when he came on, and will be fine when he learns to calm down.


It highlighted Scotland's major problem now, lack of strength in depth in key positions.

Front row looks OK as this is already a 2/3 string but they really need Nel back, second row is OK but old as back up to the Greys, in fact the whole pack is OK as are centers but 9,10 15 looks weak from the bench.


I was at the game - I was impressed by the French. They came to Scotland at a potentially very difficult time - the Scots' confidence was sky-high, they are building momentum, while France may have been fragile in front of their own crowd after not getting the win they deserved last week. But they hit the Scots hard and fully deserved the win, a nice mix of open play and brutal scrummaging (although the 2nd half deteriorated a bit). Picamoles must be the best player in the NH right now. Price definitely needs to learn to calm down - I really don't understand how he stayed on the pitch a few minutes after coming on. I like strong scrum-halves, but not stupid ones.

Also, I'm pleased to have been there for one of the worst conversion attempts of all time!
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Nikki Gradual » 13 Feb 2017, 14:03

Geezee wrote:
Nikki Gradual wrote:
andymacandy wrote:One question- why did Wales not get penalised for crossing when they scored? It was a great set piece, but Im sure the Welsh centre crossed in front Williams as he went for the posts.


I thought that too, but let it go. I can no longer tell the difference between what are considered legitimate dummy runners and decoys and blocking or crossing.


You can decoy but you can't take an opposing man out of his ability to tackle the man with the ball (ie by crossing in front of him, running into him) - that didn't happen here, it was just a pure dummy run.


That's what I kind of thought at the time and didn't think anymore about it until Andy raised it.

I've had another look now and what is on the video here at about 1minute (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90_jUX5CP0I) may be OK now, but would have been the textbook definition of crossing in my playing days. Farrell may not have been physically touched, but he was absolutely taken out of the game by Scott Williams running precisely between him and Liam Williams at the very moment that he took the ball. If you freeze it at 1.02 you will see how perfectly it is timed.

Perhaps someone can explain to me, I still don't get why that isn't crossing at the moment.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Geezee » 13 Feb 2017, 14:51

but he is not running in front of either of his own players, which is what would constitute crossing as he would block Farrell's ability to tackle the man with the ball (either the passer or receiver) - he runs between them. I don't think this would have been crossing back in my day either, and I was a centre/fly-half so we used to practice this kind of stuff all the time (but in truth it does happen in the blink of an eye so even after looking at it several times I can barely make out what each player is doing).
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Nikki Gradual » 13 Feb 2017, 18:02

My old fly halves, wings and centres just ran into each other whenever they tried it, the useless preening ponces.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 13 Feb 2017, 23:11

Geezee wrote:
Also, I'm pleased to have been there for one of the worst conversion attempts of all time!


Some Scottish fans got a bit irate because you could hear someone telling him to hurry up on the ref mike.
But it turned out that it was Nathan Hines :)
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby The Great Defector » 23 Feb 2017, 17:14

http://www.rte.ie/tv/programmes/thetoughesttrade.html

Just thought you might be interested cope since it's shane Williams. You might need something to be able to watch it on the player though when they show it.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 24 Feb 2017, 07:56

The Great Defector wrote:http://www.rte.ie/tv/programmes/thetoughesttrade.html

Just thought you might be interested cope since it's shane Williams. You might need something to be able to watch it on the player though when they show it.


Thanks DM
I will watch that if I can get it to work
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Belle Lettre » 25 Feb 2017, 16:18

YA BEAUTY
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 25 Feb 2017, 22:37

Worst half of rugby from Wales in years, truly awful, too much yakking at ref and a complete meltdown.

Ireland France was an absolute borefest worthy of England at their very worst.

Ireland are a very clinical and very boring side to watch as a neutral.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Nikki Gradual » 26 Feb 2017, 08:48

Copehead wrote:Worst half of rugby from Wales in years, truly awful, too much yakking at ref and a complete meltdown.


I think that is just the beginning of the meltdown. That performance needs to prompt come big changes. The tackling was non-existent. AWJ being overruled by his kickers – WTF?

Copehead wrote:Ireland France was an absolute borefest worthy of England at their very worst. Ireland are a very clinical and very boring side to watch as a neutral.


Been saying this for years. O'Gara has handed the wannabe Rob Andrew baton on to Sexton and they really do play soul-crushingly turgid rugby. I think the only difference is the Irish are obviously rather less arrogant and detestable than Carling's England so they don't get the same grief for it.

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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby andymacandy » 26 Feb 2017, 09:18

Nikki Gradual wrote:
Now, hold tight, that vicious bastard macandy will be along to gloat in a minute.

:D

On cue............

Chuffed to bits. I admit I was surprised at how Wales had dropped off the form they showed against England. I suspect that with Wales not being the underdogs, we shook them out of their concentration when things didnt go their way. I felt that the dissallowed try in the first half was a turning point. Score that, and we are in real trouble.But Barclay was very calm, and Russell kicked his points. Genuine team effort, and a bench that carries its weight now. Watson immense.
I cannot see AWJ as Lions captain. The Gray boys are in front on yesterdays showing, and England have a couple of decent locks too (understatement). But it has to be said that Warburton was outstanding yesterday. He is a Lions starter.Nailed on.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 26 Feb 2017, 11:46

Nikki Gradual wrote:
Copehead wrote:Worst half of rugby from Wales in years, truly awful, too much yakking at ref and a complete meltdown.


I think that is just the beginning of the meltdown. That performance needs to prompt come big changes. The tackling was non-existent. AWJ being overruled by his kickers – WTF?

Copehead wrote:Ireland France was an absolute borefest worthy of England at their very worst. Ireland are a very clinical and very boring side to watch as a neutral.


Been saying this for years. O'Gara has handed the wannabe Rob Andrew baton on to Sexton and they really do play soul-crushingly turgid rugby. I think the only difference is the Irish are obviously rather less arrogant and detestable than Carling's England so they don't get the same grief for it.

Now, hold tight, that vicious bastard macandy will be along to gloat in a minute.


Jones AW was brought in to provide leadership how the fuck can he let his kickers over rule him?

The trouble is you can't make big changes in Welsh rugby because the pool is too small to fish in.

I'd drop Webb and Biggar just for their petulant behaviour but I doubt Sam Davies is ready or able to take over and other than that that is the best that could be put out.

The problem appears to be Howley, if wales had any sense they'd have poached Vern Cotter but they can't as Gatland is in place till the next RWC, too long.

The bench was baffling, Roberts is a starter or nothing not a finisher he brings nothing to the backline, he only plays 12. Wales are getting like a premiership football side with a weak manager who want to run things themselves. The lack of discipline was terrible and will make them unpopular with refs, that is Jones' fault as well, he needs to control his own team far batter and he is playing himself out of the Lions team by his lack of leadership skills.

Ireland are a thoroughly difficult team to like at the moment, Murray and Sexton are obviously brilliant but obviously pricks of the highest order, coldly efficient with little flash in the backline despite the vaunting of Henshaw and Ringrose.

I hope Wales do them again, but on current form they will get a pasting because they will be over run up front.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby andymacandy » 26 Feb 2017, 12:56

Copehead wrote:Jones AW was brought in to provide leadership how the fuck can he let his kickers over rule him?


My only thought on this was that Halfpenny had sclaffed a relatively easy kick previous to that, and that simply doesn't happen very often.
Murrayfield is notoriously tricky in the wind, so maybe he let his kickers talk him around. Biggar is a whinger, but Halfpenny doesn't strike me that way.

I also thought that once the kick at goal had been designated, that the decision could not be changed. The ref clearly indicated that a kick was coming, but seemed to change his mind.

One of the secret skills of captaincy is being able to influence the ref without him realising that you're doing it. AWJ needs a bit more practice, and he needs Webb to shut up too.
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 26 Feb 2017, 16:31

I love the ITV commentary.

Ugo Monye about Italian forward play - this will be meat and drink to England - 10 seconds later Italy score their second try

Flats is genuinely good though, and a brilliant turn of phrase; on the Italian scrum half falling over after running into Owen Farrell " He went down like a fat boy on a seesaw" :lol:

Also getting a masterclass on the ruck laws; never seen that before, really bamboozled England " I am a referee not a coach" :)

"Off side, man with the beard" :)
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 26 Feb 2017, 16:34

Best Italian performance this six nations as well, the lack of rucks asks real questions of a team in how they deal with players milling around all over the place, it makes continuity very very difficult and for a team who builds up pressure like England want to that has been a real problem.

They have over come it a couple of times with big men offloading in a straight line and will probably do so again, but Italy could easily win this game with Owen Farrell being unable to hit a barn door with his kicking.

They need field position and continuity of possession and the lack of rucks denies them that
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby Copehead » 26 Feb 2017, 16:40

How many kicks has Farrell missed? 5?

England should be out of sight and Italy are still in sight

Then he gets the hardest one of them all :)

Some gas from Sinckler
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Re: Copehead's RWC thread NOW IN ITS 14TH GREAT YEAR

Postby The Great Defector » Yesterday, 13:02

Invents a sport, but doesn't know all the rules, might explain England's problem in football too. :lol:
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