Democrat candidates so far. . .

in reality, all of this has been a total load of old bollocks
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Davey the Fat Boy
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 01 Aug 2019, 15:19

Sneelock wrote:it really seems like the Biden/Harris Axis and the Sanders/Warren Axis to me right now. I wonder if it will seem that way to me tomorrow?


It will be interesting to see what the dominant theme of the debates turns out to be when the field winnows down. Probably still more like Night one, with Biden on trial for not being progressive enough. Which I suspect, will actually help him.
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Davey the Fat Boy
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 01 Aug 2019, 16:01

Meanwhile....

Old article, but it appears that Jimbo and his pals have been busy...
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnew ... ncna964261
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Sneelock » 01 Aug 2019, 16:57

Gabbard going after Harris flies in the face of the whole "why is everybody attacking Kindly Unca Joe?" narrative.
Kindly Unca Joe spent a whole week bragging about how he was going to fight back - singling out other candidates positions and then all the CNN pundit fat-asses spend the rest of the night acting like he got ganged up on. of course he got ganged up on. that's what happens to front runners and they've been calling him the front runner since before he even declared.

If Kindly Unca Joe is going to win hands down for not being a progressive - why does he spend so much time trying to sound like one?
and another thing, I missed the secret Bell the Cat meeting when all the "realistic/reasonable" Democrats decided that the Public Option was a realistic reasonable position. I took A LOT OF LUMPS for being unreasonable and unrealistic for supporting the public option when the O. Admin was hobnobbing with insurance companies to fashion the Affordable Care Act.

the DEMS keep moving the "reasonable/realistic" goal posts. at the same time they try to lip service and sound supportive of those same issues.
holy shit, no wonder people hate politics. another year of this crap? gloryosky!
Last edited by Sneelock on 01 Aug 2019, 17:05, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Sneelock » 01 Aug 2019, 17:03

who do you think will be back in September?
I don't think Yang is catching on - I thought he'd win the Google Sweepstakes last night but that went to Tulsi (and to a lesser extent Booker).
I thought the guaranteed income and not wearing a tie and his affable manner would get some attention. nope.

I don't think Hickenlooper will make the next round. I liked some of DeBlasio's comments - especially his closing statement but I don't think he's going to be around in September.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Sneelock » 01 Aug 2019, 19:48

Count Machuki wrote:Uh oh, Biden just dropped the malarkey bomb

Next Debate Drinking Game:
take a slug every time Joe says "Here's the deal..."
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Count Machuki » 01 Aug 2019, 20:41

Sneelock wrote:
Count Machuki wrote:Uh oh, Biden just dropped the malarkey bomb

Next Debate Drinking Game:
take a slug every time Joe says "Here's the deal..."


finish your drink when he does the "get a load of this guy" face
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Mike Boom » 01 Aug 2019, 21:47

Sneelock wrote: don't think Yang is catching on - I thought he'd win the Google Sweepstakes last night but that went to Tulsi (and to a lesser extent Booker).
I thought the guaranteed income and not wearing a tie and his affable manner would get some attention. nope.


When he said that Amazon are forcing all the closures of retail outlets and not paying a dime in tax, suddenly the whole guaranteed $1000 a month didn't sound so wacky.

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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Jimbo » 02 Aug 2019, 01:00

Sneelock wrote: Google Sweepstakes last night ... went to Tulsi.


Spa-see-ba, Vladmir. :D
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 02 Aug 2019, 01:03

Sneelock wrote:and another thing, I missed the secret Bell the Cat meeting when all the "realistic/reasonable" Democrats decided that the Public Option was a realistic reasonable position. I took A LOT OF LUMPS for being unreasonable and unrealistic for supporting the public option when the O. Admin was hobnobbing with insurance companies to fashion the Affordable Care Act.

the DEMS keep moving the "reasonable/realistic" goal posts. at the same time they try to lip service and sound supportive of those same issues.
holy shit, no wonder people hate politics. another year of this crap? gloryosky!


Okay... Let’s come at the same question from the opposite direction. When did the public option become such a valueless and (dare I say) corporate policy that you would go from taking lumps for it to decrying it as a kind of quasi-Republican plot to kill progress? Was it a terrible policy then, or did it just become one?

I submit to you that this is how progress happens. Obama moved the ball downfield enough that now a debate between Medicare for All and the Public Option makes sense. Absent the ACA we wouldn’t be within sniffing distance of that conversation.

So let’s say the Public Option is next. Once we achieve that, then the leap from ‘Medicare for All That Want It’ to ‘Medicare for All’ becomes pretty reasonable - and the progressives of that time start painting IT as an uninspiring consolation prize.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 02 Aug 2019, 01:03

Some bullshit
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 02 Aug 2019, 01:04

More bullshit
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Sneelock » 02 Aug 2019, 02:08

Davey the Fat Boy wrote:More bullshit

:lol: you can say that again!

Hey, let's cure the climate crisis the same way. Drastic Incrementalism!!!
I supported the Public Option because President Silver-Tongued Devil said it was our best option. I sat aside my intolerant lefty idealism just long enough to take him at his word. He convinced me. too bad he didn't convince himself.

well, here it comes again. Deja Fuckin' Voo! once bitten twice shy. Can you give me one good reason I should believe they really care about doing it?

The people talking about single payer are evangelical about it. people who jump up and down for things really want to get them done. Who is jumping up and down to get the public option? Exactly nobody. I think it is just a placebo panic button to make the big fat insurance company wallets feel safe.

there was a time when I was willing to be convinced otherwise but Lucy can stick that football up her ASS.
Last edited by Sneelock on 02 Aug 2019, 02:29, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Jimbo » 02 Aug 2019, 02:09

Cold War Number One: 70 years of daily national stupidity. Cold War Number Two: Still in its youth, but just as stupid. - William Blum

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Sneelock
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Sneelock » 02 Aug 2019, 02:11

anybody feel a breeze just now? a whisper of air? a slight brush of the curtains?
hmmm. maybe it was nothing. ;)
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 02 Aug 2019, 02:27

Sneelock wrote:
Davey the Fat Boy wrote:More bullshit

:lol: you can say that again!

Hey, let's cure the climate crisis the same way. Drastic Incrementalism!!!
I supported the Public Option because President Silver-Tongued Devil said it was our best option. I sat aside my intolerant lefty idealism just long enough to take him at his word. He convinced me. too bad he didn't convince himself.

well, here it comes again. Deja Fuckin' Voo! once bitten twice shy. give me one good reason I should believe they really care about doing it?
it's better than nothing but the people talking about single payer are evangelical about it. people who jump up and down for things really want to get them done. I think "the public option" is just a placebo panic button to make the big fat insurance company wallets feel safe.

there was a time when I was willing to be convinced otherwise but Lucy can stick that football up her ASS.


What do you suppose we’d be talking about healthcare-wise if Obama hadn’t bothered with the ACA?
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Jimbo » 02 Aug 2019, 02:30

Is it just now that I'm hearing it'll take four years for single payer to kick in?
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Sneelock » 02 Aug 2019, 02:33

(Sneelock swerves from Davey’s loaded question and u-turns into a labored anecdote)

When I was a kid a neighbor told me if I cleaned out his garage he would buy me a hamburger. I did an awesome job but other kids started hanging around “helping out” so they could get a hamburger too. The neighbor saw what a good job “we” did and took us out for ice cream.

I like ice cream just fine but those fuckers promised me a hamburger. Some people make promises they don’t bother to keep. I think it is entirely clear eyed & prudent of me to suspect this is one of those times.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 02 Aug 2019, 02:40

Sorry about your childhood trauma.

I’m just pointing out, this is the only progress we’ve seen on this issue in our lifetimes. None of the more-progressive-than-thou leaders have ever actually managed any tangible outcomes that come close to what Obama accomplished. Now suddenly the public option is the consensus fallback position. Isn’t that a good thing?
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Jimbo » 02 Aug 2019, 02:57

Davey the Fat Boy wrote:Sorry about your childhood trauma.

I’m just pointing out, this is the only progress we’ve seen on this issue in our lifetimes. None of the more-progressive-than-thou leaders have ever actually managed any tangible outcomes that come close to what Obama accomplished. Now suddenly the public option is the consensus fallback position. Isn’t that a good thing?


I remember thinking what a good idea Romney-care was in Mass.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Jimbo » 02 Aug 2019, 03:08

The point in the debate about the stupidity of destroying Obamacare for whatever else hit home. All the haggling to get Obamacare, I think, let's build upon it. My first ever job with healthcare - teaching in Florida in 1987 - was one where I had to choose a private plan. I thought it was pretty cool. Never once thought about the dirty profit the insurance company made.

But then, as long as Bernie-care can be done, it sounds even better but not disastrous if it doesn't happen.

Just getting out of 3 months of Japanese hospitalization and surgery and I have a co-pay of a few 1000 dollars but it'd be nice if that was zero. It's still pretty cheap considering the services from privately owned hospital and government organized after care.
Cold War Number One: 70 years of daily national stupidity. Cold War Number Two: Still in its youth, but just as stupid. - William Blum