Democrat candidates so far. . .

in reality, all of this has been a total load of old bollocks
sloopjohnc
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Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby sloopjohnc » 14 Dec 2018, 19:18

I'm wondering what people think of these folks. Personally, I hope Amy Klobuchar runs.

Kamala Harris
Bernie Sanders
Elizabeth Warren
Amy Klobuchar
Beto O'Rourke
Joe Biden
Sherrod Brown
Cory Booker
Julian Castro
Kristen Gillibrand
Tom Steyer
Eric Swalwell
Stacy Abrams
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Sneelock
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Sneelock » 14 Dec 2018, 19:29

I'm going to start with Beto because I've been reading a lot about him. If you follow anybody on Facebook to the left of Joe Biden then I'll bet you've read some of this stuff too. the basic thrust of all the space on Beto lately has been that he's really not all that "progressive" (compared to others on that list) and pointing out where his money comes from and what they've gotten for it.

well, let's start there. I saw plenty of his speeches so, right after that election, when people started saying he should run for President, it didn't take a lot of imagination to see why. Let's call it the X Factor. How progressive he was compared to others, where his money came from and what he did for it wasn't really an issue in that campaign. He talked good. He got people excited. He took firm positions in an affable and upbeat way. I think this shit is important. Look at all them polls about Biden & Hillary. well, do YOU know anybody who is excited about Biden or Hillary? I know people who are making the case for them but it is a case they base in what they see as practical thinking.

I will vote, in the primary, for the candidate that comes the closest to making me want to wave my magic wand and make them President. In the general I will vote for the party's candidate unless the party has gone to Crazy Town.

it's important for people to get excited. I hope we have one of those on that list.
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Davey the Fat Boy
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 14 Dec 2018, 19:58

I like Sherrod Brown the best. I think he would unify the Democratic Party’s progressive and establishment wings better than anyone else. Plus - he’d play well in the rust belt and Midwest states where the election will surely be decided.

But Ohio has a Republican Governor, so we’d be ceding a Senate seat by running him. As it stands, we have an uphill climb to take the Senate back. If we go with Brown, it gets less likely.

Of the remaining candidates listed, there are some real risks.

Sanders and Biden are the most well-known and the least susceptible to negative branding. But both are of an advanced age. I think either could beat Trump, but both would be easy pickings in 2024 for a young Republican looking to rebrand the party against an octogenarian Democrat who will likely have few accomplishments due to a divided Congress.

Warren, Harris, Booker, Adams, Klobuchar, and Gillibrand all beg the terrible question that I hate to give voice to: Can a women or an African American run effectively against Trump. Essentially - do they give him a contrast that works in his favor?

I absolutely abhor the idea of not being open to any candidate regardless of race or gender - but we’re in an ugly moment in our history, and the risk involved in picking any of those candidates can’t be fully ignored. We can decide to push forward anyways, but we need to acknowledge the risk. Of those candidates, I think Kamala Harris has the most upside. I expect her to be the VP on whatever ticket we arrive at, but I’d happily support her at the top of the ticket.

I didn’t include O’Roarke and Castro in the above list, as I’m not sure what the dynamics would be around a Latino candidate. I’d expect a groundswell of support in Latino dominated areas. It will be interesting to see if African American turnout would rise or fall. Of the two, Beto has the star power, Castro has the resume. This year - I’ll take star power. But I’m not sure the Beto can make the leap from the house to the White House.

Finally you get to guys like Swalwell and Steyer. I don’t think they are legitimate candidates.

So given all of the above - I’m torn between Sherrod Brown and Kamala Harris. They’d make a pretty good ticket together too - wouldn’t they?

But that Senate seat could swing me to another candidate.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby $P.Muff$ » 14 Dec 2018, 20:19

Sherrod Brown is the "dignity of work" guy who has (as far as I can tell) never been employed in the private sector. How will that play out amongst the working poor?

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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby toomanyhatz » 14 Dec 2018, 20:25

I'd take any of them in a heartbeat.

We're not tearing down the walls, motherfuckers. We're in triage. I want whoever has the best chance to win.

Realistically that's probably Biden, at least as of right now. But someone's going to rise to the top, and chances are it'll be the one you least expect...
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 14 Dec 2018, 20:35

$P.Muff$ wrote:Sherrod Brown is the "dignity of work" guy who has (as far as I can tell) never been employed in the private sector. How will that play out amongst the working poor?



Sanders-campaign talking points?

Brown is extremely popular in Ohio - which is “working poor central.” Most of the working poor believe in the dignity of work.

Besides - he’d be contrasting with Donald Trump. So...
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby sloopjohnc » 14 Dec 2018, 21:09

Someone on Twitter mentioned Eric Swalwell. He's my congressman, but I replied that he needed a charisma upgrade and it's the difference between watching Barry Bonds bat compared to Mike Trout. Trout is just as good, but if you're running for President, you need someone where everyone stops to see what they say next. I don't doubt his smarts, but his charisma is deficient.

It's kinda the difference between Obama and HRC.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby sloopjohnc » 14 Dec 2018, 21:11

toomanyhatz wrote:Realistically that's probably Biden, at least as of right now. But someone's going to rise to the top, and chances are it'll be the one you least expect...


Too old and too wild in his words.

And he admits to one of them.

Also, they'll bring back his plagiarism, which sunk him in a previous election. However, I don't know if that matters that much, these days.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby sloopjohnc » 14 Dec 2018, 21:12

Davey the Fat Boy wrote:I didn’t include O’Roarke and Castro in the above list, as I’m not sure what the dynamics would be around a Latino candidate.


I saw Castro in a very impressive interview last night with Chris Hayes last night on MSNBC. He was very direct in his answers, which I always appreciate. Even Maddow, who follows his show was impressed.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby sloopjohnc » 14 Dec 2018, 21:16

Harris is my senator, and while she's been the state's Attorney General besides Senator, I think she has to work on her presentation. By which I mean the timbre of her voice. She can get kinda nasally. People may call that superficial (plenty did on Twitter), but running for President, you have to appeal to all people, even superficially, to draw them in, and presentation is a big part of it.

Obama had a great speaking voice. You have to have some authority and heft to draw in all people.
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Davey the Fat Boy
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 14 Dec 2018, 22:25

You ever hear Trump’s voice?
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Sneelock » 14 Dec 2018, 22:35

people are saying it's the best voice ever!
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby sloopjohnc » 14 Dec 2018, 23:10

Davey the Fat Boy wrote:You ever hear Trump’s voice?


They had years to get accustomed to it. And it fits his image.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby sloopjohnc » 14 Dec 2018, 23:11

Sneelock wrote:people are saying it's the best voice ever!


:lol:
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby $P.Muff$ » 15 Dec 2018, 00:20

Davey the Fat Boy wrote:
$P.Muff$ wrote:Sherrod Brown is the "dignity of work" guy who has (as far as I can tell) never been employed in the private sector. How will that play out amongst the working poor?



Sanders-campaign talking points?

Brown is extremely popular in Ohio - which is “working poor central.” Most of the working poor believe in the dignity of work.

Besides - he’d be contrasting with Donald Trump. So...



In case you weren't aware I'm not a huge Bernie supporter. Sure, he'd get my vote - as any of these people would against Trump.

I need to look into Brown's margins in rural Ohio. Nothing at all wrong with taking pride in your work and one should absolutely expect to be treated with dignity and respect when doing so. I just feel Trump could throw out the old 'job creator' bit and many will buy it again.

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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Sneelock » 15 Dec 2018, 00:29

well, I think a lot of people realized they got chumped. those "blue collar voters" the mainstream media couldn't shut the fuck up about won't be as enthusiastic this time out. IMO that's why he keeps throwing so much red meat he needs a butcher's smock.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby $P.Muff$ » 15 Dec 2018, 00:33

There is always the slight chance Pence will be president by 2020.

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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby $P.Muff$ » 15 Dec 2018, 00:36

I should add that I would like to see a candidate that doesn't write the south of as a lost cause.

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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby Sneelock » 15 Dec 2018, 01:02

I like Sherrod Brown and would have no trouble at all voting for him. But, you know, I wonder if guys like that will ever get elected to high office again?
I mean, TRUMP might have broke the mold, you know?

the entrepreneur Andrew Yang is running as a Democrat. Author and new age motivational speaker Marianne Williamson is running as a Democrat.
while it's true there have always been longshots that have run for President - not in the shadows of another long shot.

I'll talk about Harris later - she's my senator too and I like her a lot. For now I just want to say that I think the list above while very well reasoned sort of presumes that we are not in post Trump America. Maybe Oprah isn't running but I think her phone is ringing off the hook. there are people who have decided that the only way to beat the 500 pound gorilla is with another 500 pound gorilla. that list of qualified candidates might be a relic of another era.
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Re: Democrat candidates so far. . .

Postby toomanyhatz » 15 Dec 2018, 01:07

Don't know enough about the others, but certainly Beto O'Rourke is more popular in the south than anywhere else. He certainly gave his red state at least a bit of a purplish hue...
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