selling out? ooh no art is a COMMERCIAL VENTURE

in reality, all of this has been a total load of old bollocks
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Re: selling out

Postby Rayge » 23 Mar 2018, 18:32

Alleged Local Policeman wrote:We are all prostitutes.


Even us whores got standards
In timeless moments we live forever

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Re: selling out

Postby sloopjohnc » 23 Mar 2018, 22:29

The Modernist wrote:Is it any worse than doing a crappy film? They're all acting jobs aren't they?


Michael Caine said in an interview that he did the crappy movies like Jaws 4 that paid him tons so he could do good movies like The Quiet American.

It was a trade off for him.

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Re: selling out

Postby sneelock » 23 Mar 2018, 22:59

Unward Brank wrote:People were shouting 'SELL OUT!' at every rocker in the 70s/80s, you must have noticed that? it doesn't happen today.


I think there are a lot of reasons. first of all, I'm going to be upfront. I love millennials with their cute little phones in their cute little faces. I'm going to let them off the hook just as a matter of principle - they've got enough problems.

yeah, it doesn't mean anything to them but I don't really see why it should. I was one of those people who used the term "sell out" - perhaps a little too liberally. the number one reason for this was pretty simple - I didn't like it. take "My Love" by Paul McWhat's His Face. I absolutely fucking hated this song that was played everywhere. to make matters worse, I had loved a great many of his songs up to that point.

I think another factor is what we used to call "the counterculture". People who read "Reader's Digest" probably didn't read "Rolling Stone". so, when McWhat's His Face sucked - I had somebody to blame - Paul. How dare he care about "whoa whoa whoa-ing" to those square Readers' Digest readers. now that Daddy Warbucks OWNS everything this is less noticeable & remarked upon

I think we still have arbitrary lines for people to choose sides on - the internet has given us more than ever. I just don't think "selling out" is really one of them.

ah, the good old days...
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Re: selling out

Postby never/ever » 23 Mar 2018, 23:22

I don't take millenials serious, especially if they follow bloggers/vloggers who themselves are wannabe celebs being paid ridiculous amounts of money by advertisers to flog their wares.... and no one really cares.

Who are they to criticise the celebs that are out there selling whatever pays their bills?

Johnny Lydon may be the figurehead for punk but he does shit in a toilet and uses butter in meals. Good for him.
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Re: selling out

Postby bobzilla77 » 23 Mar 2018, 23:48

Unward Brank wrote:Fair enough.

I just think there’s been a change over the last generation or two. The concept of ‘selling out’ is as alien to most people today as a love-in, or filterless cigarettes.


It's because those kids have ruined the music industry. This is the price they get to pay - all their favorite artists have no idea how they will pay the rent, so they will take money every single pace it can be found.

The audience understands - they're working in the "gig economy" too.
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Re: selling out

Postby Quaco » 23 Mar 2018, 23:51

As far as John Lydon goes, he will always be bigger and better than whoever thinks he sold out with the butter ads. You can't really take it seriously anyway. Just look at him. More power to him.
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Re: selling out

Postby sneelock » 24 Mar 2018, 00:11

I think the main differece between the Keitel & the Lydon is that one isn't a very good commercial and one is.
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Re: selling out

Postby The Modernist » 24 Mar 2018, 00:11

sloopjohnc wrote:
The Modernist wrote:Is it any worse than doing a crappy film? They're all acting jobs aren't they?


Michael Caine said in an interview that he did the crappy movies like Jaws 4 that paid him tons so he could do good movies like The Quiet American.

It was a trade off for him.


Except he was doing those films a good thirty years before The Quiet American".

His famous quote on this regards him starring in Jaws 3 " "I have never seen it, but by all accounts it is terrible. However, I have seen the house that it built, and it is terrific.”.
...which seems a little more honest and realistic. :D

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Re: selling out

Postby sneelock » 24 Mar 2018, 00:15

I think a factor in "selling out" is in the character of the "artist" (or "prostitute" if you prefer)

me, I think Michael Caine is marvelous in some very bad movies.
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Re: selling out

Postby Quaco » 24 Mar 2018, 00:17

Very Stable Baron wrote:Maybe the people of the 60s and 70s were more naive.

I think maybe we have realized there are far worse villains than an artist who is trying to keep his or her business going. Far worse. Maybe at the time, an artist selling a song to a company might have been an ideological blow that was thought to set back the delicate possibility of revolution. Now that the revolution didn't happen the way it was hoped to, it matters less. Also, it's common knowledge that music doesn't pay the way it did back then, so getting on a soundtrack to a dumb film, advertising a product, or making demeaning appearances just seems like a necessity now.

The only sell out that I still struggle with is Elton John playing a big Rush Limbaugh event for $1 million. Maybe he put the money towards a good cause. I know those two have a lot of issues they disagree vehemently on, so I'm not sure how John conscioned it. For the record, he did say Limbaugh was a gentleman the whole night, far different from his foul on-air persona.
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Re: selling out

Postby sneelock » 24 Mar 2018, 00:26

Rush has done a lot to make Certain people inflexible in their opinions about his lifestyle. certainly Elton's opinion about it matters more than mine does.
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Re: selling out

Postby Quaco » 24 Mar 2018, 00:40

To the shock of many (given the gap in their political ideologies), Elton John performed at Rush Limbaugh’s wedding in 2010 and, in a new interview with USA Today, the performer opened up about his friendship with the conservative talk show host.

John’s hope of eroding stigmas has led him into some unlikely alliances. After he agreed to perform at Limbaugh’s wedding in 2010, the two men bonded over music and formed a friendship, despite Limbaugh’s conservative views.

“He sends me the loveliest e-mails,” said John. “What I get from Rush privately and what I get from Rush publicly are two different things. I’m just trying to break him down.”

So is the on-air Limbaugh just an act? The interview seems to suggest that. Traci Watson, who conducted the interview for USA Today, writes John believes that “his friend Rush Limbaugh doesn’t truly oppose gay marriage.”

Which means that Rush is the hypocrite, sowing strife when he doesn't believe it himself. I still hope John put the money to some really good liberal use!
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Re: selling out

Postby Snarfyguy » 24 Mar 2018, 04:53

sloopjohnc wrote:
The Modernist wrote:Is it any worse than doing a crappy film? They're all acting jobs aren't they?


Michael Caine said in an interview that he did the crappy movies like Jaws 4 that paid him tons so he could do good movies like The Quiet American.

It was a trade off for him.

Even that can't explain a movie as bad as Blame it on Rio.
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Re: selling out

Postby Snarfyguy » 24 Mar 2018, 04:57

sCUNTlock wrote:I think the main differece between the Keitel & the Lydon is that one isn't a very good commercial and one is.

In the end, this is what it's all about. You can do it well or you can do it poorly.
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Re: selling out

Postby Samoan » 24 Mar 2018, 07:47

My brother was pals with and used to share a house with Fifi (Fiona) Shaw back in student days in Dublin in the early eighties. One of my bosses at work in the nineties, was also friends with her and knows my brother and told me she unashamedly eschewed the Royal Shakespeare Company to star in the crappy movie Three Men and a Little Lady to pay off her mortgage in London.
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Re: selling out

Postby Insouciant Western People » 27 Mar 2018, 11:39

Very Stable Baron wrote:I don’t have any particular investment in the “integrity” or whatever of any particular artist.


Me neither.

I like John Lee Hooker's response when David Letterman asked him why he sported a dollar bill badge on his suit jacket lapel.

"Because I plays for money".
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Re: selling out

Postby Deebank » 27 Mar 2018, 18:09

The thing about the Keitel ad is that he’s using a character from Pulp Fiction - a character presumably created and written by Quentin Tarantino.

Does QT get a cut?
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Re: selling out? ooh no art is a COMMERCIAL VENTURE

Postby The Beatles » 13 Apr 2018, 12:01

Image
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Re: selling out? ooh no art is a COMMERCIAL VENTURE

Postby gash on ignore » 13 Apr 2018, 12:02

It’s not art, it’s a job.
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Re: selling out? ooh no art is a COMMERCIAL VENTURE

Postby The Beatles » 13 Apr 2018, 14:02

In many cases, yeah.

But there is this thing FLASH OF INSPIRATION, dig?
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