Facebook (pt. 538)

in reality, all of this has been a total load of old bollocks
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby The Prof » 13 Dec 2017, 18:59

What advertisers can do now is upload email addresses from any database and have facebook find their FB profile and place ads on their timeline. So, instead of spamming customers with emails, advertisers can target them on facebook instead

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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby Your Friendly Neighbourhood Postman » 13 Dec 2017, 19:03

Snarfyguy wrote:I worry about the effects of a world saturated in social media on my six year-old as she continues to develop. Of course she has no access to that stuff yet, but it's only a matter of time.

What effect does a kid's snout being in a gizmo all the time have on cognitive and neural development? Who knows.


I think it's a safe bet that people dependent on their gadget for planning their route (instead of using a map, learning, looking around) are actually outsourcing their natural (and trainable) brain capacities for spatial orientation, learning, and memory.

It's the London cab drivers experiment in reverse:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/677048.stm

I am quite wary about the (over)use of smartphones and social sites by kids in full development (well, your brain changes during your whole lifetime, but in children it's all every vulnerable, and there are numerous 'time windows', in which the environment is key to proper maturing of the brain. For me, gizmos don't count as a 'good environment'. I will look tomorrow if I can find texts in English by psychiatrist and researcher Manfred Spitzer, who's a real expert on these things. He is very critical about overexposing young ones (and adults, for that matter) to the fast, loud, ever-changing, hyper-commercial, and often aggressive sensory overload in question. (Spitzer also is a formidable social critic in general, and not afraid to step forward, inside his own institute and in serious media).
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby sneelock » 13 Dec 2017, 19:11

there's a new Microsoft commercial featuring a kid who uses his tablet for everything. he researches his homework, plots his bike route, uses public transport website, etc..

at the end of the commercial he lays in the yard looking at his tablet. "what are you doing on your computer?" a lady asks. "what's a computer?" the kid replies.
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby Count Machuki » 13 Dec 2017, 19:24

Sneelock wrote: "what's a computer?"


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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby Your Friendly Neighbourhood Postman » 13 Dec 2017, 19:24

Sneelock wrote:there's a new Microsoft commercial featuring a kid who uses his tablet for everything. he researches his homework, plots his bike route, uses public transport website, etc..

at the end of the commercial he lays in the yard looking at his tablet. "what are you doing on your computer?" a lady asks. "what's a computer?" the kid replies.


:D

(There are people who describe the smartphone/tablet as a modern prosthesis. Something that you can't do without, in leading a normal life. You'd be handicapped if it stopped working. Not knowing what to do or where to go. Helpless.

If the idea of outsourcing your natural capacities to that thing, so much that you actually "silence down" brain areas that relate to those capacities, is valid, then there's little to laugh about all this, in the end, IMHO. But your quote is funny, mind.)
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby sneelock » 13 Dec 2017, 19:34

well, as in most things, I'm of two minds about it.
on the one hand, is a map made of paper a more noble thing than a map on a device?
no, I don't think so.

on the other hand, is the ability to use a map made of paper a good skill to have?
maybe.

I only know enough math to use a calculator. so, I'm not good at math but I KNOW about math.
maybe not knowing about maps or math is no big thing. maybe it is.
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby Harvey K-Tel » 13 Dec 2017, 19:37

Or maybe you're just a big dummy.
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby sneelock » 13 Dec 2017, 19:44

:lol:
Oh, I’m not so big.
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby Your Friendly Neighbourhood Postman » 13 Dec 2017, 21:56

Sneelock wrote:well, as in most things, I'm of two minds about it.
on the one hand, is a map made of paper a more noble thing than a map on a device?
no, I don't think so.

on the other hand, is the ability to use a map made of paper a good skill to have?
maybe.

I only know enough math to use a calculator. so, I'm not good at math but I KNOW about math.
maybe not knowing about maps or math is no big thing. maybe it is.


Good points, I won't in any way go against them -

my ideas derive for a major part from my dad's life. A truckdriver, who had the best capacities for orientation I ever saw in anyone. In his early years (age 16-25), and that was just after WW II, he used paper maps, and his intuition. Literally, he used the position of the sun, the time of day, and his own feelings as the guiding principle. He learned from all this. And he always stayed in close contact with "the common locals", to ask, if he was in doubt, be it in Germany, Italy, France, Austria, or in Switzerland.

He had something that most folks nowadays sorely lack: close contact with physical reality.

In middle age, he was, because of all this, a unique person. And, for good reason, my personal hero. Others admired him, and alas, even more others were terribly jealous, and they made that known to him. Those others were far more wealthy, some used taxis whenever they could. Outsourcing is the key word here. In retrospect, those others were vain, and lazy simpletons, dependent on outside forces to do what they liked to do.

My Dad, would he still live now, would find it tragic that so many youngsters of today, who think that they are masters of their environments, and can do everything with the aid of electronic prostheses, would be totally helpless without these (expensive) gadgets.

I, as someone who uses his PC (an older type), sensibly, and who never ever would want a smartphone (even if I'd be paid for its use), agree with my Dad's sentiments.
On the whole, I'd rather be in Wallenpaupack.

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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby Toby » 13 Dec 2017, 22:40

Meh, you say that, but GoogleMaps has made my life a lot easier and I spent my youth as a scout, so I know all about orientation and being aware of where I am.

In retrospect, those others were vain, and lazy simpletons, dependent on outside forces to do what they liked to do.


I'm sorry, but perhaps just they had money and used it to pay for services so that they could be engaged in other activities. The notion that someone is morally superior just because they don't use a Taxi or wotnot is just plain rubbish.

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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby Robert » 13 Dec 2017, 23:54

Re: Facebook. The most amazing thing, I find, is that FB
has managed to plant a notion that even if you don’t have one, you can still have a wonderful & cheery life-online.
Last edited by Robert on 13 Dec 2017, 23:58, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby Robert » 13 Dec 2017, 23:58

Toby wrote:Meh, you say that, but GoogleMaps has made my life a lot easier and I spent my youth as a scout, so I know all about orientation and being aware of where .



Yes true but I guess what Frank is referring to is that because you have digital tools that ‘ make life easier’ some natural life skills get lost.

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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby ORORORO » 14 Dec 2017, 00:00

I'm not sure if we've addressed what the person mentioned in the OP was concerned about.

It's an old topic, I know, but has social media killed off face-to-face, 'naked' communication (or maybe more accurately, people's interest in it)? If so, does it matter?
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby sneelock » 14 Dec 2017, 00:08

I wouldn't say "killed"
I might say "endangered"
I can't really say if it matters.


Bride Of Sea Of Tunes wrote:my ideas derive for a major part from my dad's life...
He had something that most folks nowadays sorely lack: close contact with physical reality.


well, there's the backbone of the matter right there, isn't it?

...My Dad, would he still live now, would find it tragic that so many youngsters of today, who think that they are masters of their environments, and can do everything with the aid of electronic prostheses, would be totally helpless without these (expensive) gadgets.

I, as someone who uses his PC (an older type), sensibly, and who never ever would want a smartphone (even if I'd be paid for its use), agree with my Dad's sentiments.


I agree with the issue of character but I'm so glad I finally gave in on the smart-phone (I've had one maybe 2 or 3 years now).

we had these fires out here REAL bad last week. if it hadn't been for the WAZE app on my smart phone I would have spent literally HOURS in traffic for about 3 days. Instead, the real time satellite or whatever coaxed me along on ridiculous routes that actually got me where I was going in a timely fashion.

Now, maybe I could have sat behind the wheel with mighty thoughts and used that time wisely. I didn't. I plugged into the collecto-sphere and got my butt home as soon as I could. I didn't make the character building decision and I guess I'm cool with that.

I know what you mean, I might even agree. I'm all for character. I know delightful young people who never seem to spend any time alone with their thoughts. they still manage to be delightful but I can't help but hope they spend some time alone with their thoughts every once in a while and I hope it doesn't take a period of darkness for that to happen.
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby mentalist (slight return) » 14 Dec 2017, 02:59

Kids aren't really into Facebook from what I gather, at least not as much as us middle aged types. It's the parents social media platform. I can think of any number of my friend's kids and they are just on Facebook. They may have an account but almost never use it. It's more Snapchat for them.
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby ORORORO » 14 Dec 2017, 04:04

Yes, that’s my experience too. Fuck knows what Snapchat’s all about.
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby Goat Boy » 14 Dec 2017, 11:13

!!VAPRANT!! wrote:I'm not sure if we've addressed what the person mentioned in the OP was concerned about.

It's an old topic, I know, but has social media killed off face-to-face, 'naked' communication (or maybe more accurately, people's interest in it)? If so, does it matter?


Personally I find it has made socialising easier because you can easily arrange shit with mates.

There's also a belief I think that real life friends are automatically better than online friends as if those relationships are more meaningful because they are face to face but I don't think that's necessarily the case.
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby ORORORO » 14 Dec 2017, 11:24

You get to know a lot more about your online mates in many cases. Their tastes, their interests, their opinions. They often form the basis of the conversations you have. Whereas with real-life mates, you spend half the time moaning about shit. That’s once you’ve decided where to go, and where to sit.
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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby Your Friendly Neighbourhood Postman » 14 Dec 2017, 12:16

Sneelock wrote:I wouldn't say "killed"
I might say "endangered"
I can't really say if it matters.


Bride Of Sea Of Tunes wrote:my ideas derive for a major part from my dad's life...
He had something that most folks nowadays sorely lack: close contact with physical reality.


well, there's the backbone of the matter right there, isn't it?

...My Dad, would he still live now, would find it tragic that so many youngsters of today, who think that they are masters of their environments, and can do everything with the aid of electronic prostheses, would be totally helpless without these (expensive) gadgets.

I, as someone who uses his PC (an older type), sensibly, and who never ever would want a smartphone (even if I'd be paid for its use), agree with my Dad's sentiments.


I agree with the issue of character but I'm so glad I finally gave in on the smart-phone (I've had one maybe 2 or 3 years now).

we had these fires out here REAL bad last week. if it hadn't been for the WAZE app on my smart phone I would have spent literally HOURS in traffic for about 3 days. Instead, the real time satellite or whatever coaxed me along on ridiculous routes that actually got me where I was going in a timely fashion.

Now, maybe I could have sat behind the wheel with mighty thoughts and used that time wisely. I didn't. I plugged into the collecto-sphere and got my butt home as soon as I could. I didn't make the character building decision and I guess I'm cool with that.

I know what you mean, I might even agree. I'm all for character. I know delightful young people who never seem to spend any time alone with their thoughts. they still manage to be delightful but I can't help but hope they spend some time alone with their thoughts every once in a while and I hope it doesn't take a period of darkness for that to happen.


Thanks, Sneelock -

your final paragraph is essential. I'll ponder it for awhile. For now I think it is a clear description of why these friendly young folks sometimes can fall into despair in situations where there is a sad event in their lives, and where they are obliged to part with their electronic device for a prolonged time (say, one or two days). We're not built to communicate/play/distract ourselves all of the time. Nor are we made to be 'available' on a 24/7 basis (= to have our phone beside our beds and react immediately to whatever it invites us to do.) Needless to say there are exceptions to this (young parents, when you're in emergency work, and so on).
On the whole, I'd rather be in Wallenpaupack.

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Re: Facebook (pt. 538)

Postby Insouciant Western People » 14 Dec 2017, 12:47

!!VAPRANT!! wrote:Whereas with real-life mates, you spend half the time moaning about shit.


Half the time?

You've never been to a northern Jolly Up.
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