"Fake News"

in reality, all of this has been a total load of old bollocks

Ban "fake news" sites?

Yes
1
14%
No
6
86%
 
Total votes: 7

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Jimbo
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"Fake News"

Postby Jimbo » 24 Dec 2016, 12:38

Hearing a lot about fake news lately, especially on internet sites flagged for being fake news sites. But aren't the corporate and the mainstream public media guilty of putting out misleading and propagandistic info, fake news? I am especially concerned recently in this odd push for a war with Russia. Sites that have been pushing against this push are the first sites to be flagged, to be denied access to FB newsgroups. Look, I don't want war with any country but especially not Russia. Not that I love Russia; I've never been there but a war with Russia could easily mean the death of us all, and since our MSM are all bent on firing us up to hate Russia again we need to hear and read more rational, calmer, more truthful voices and words. Come on, if there is a dodgy site you know it's dodgy, don't you? (You are thinking of Alex Jones aren't you?) Anyway, let's not let the bastards win, I say!
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zoomboogity
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby zoomboogity » 24 Dec 2016, 14:41

A lot of fake news sites aren't part of a master plan to bamboozle the citizenry, they're just out to make a buck. There are a couple guys in LA - Long Beach, actually - who started a fake news site about a year ago. They ended up making more money than they expected, sometimes $25,000 in a month. They said they had to keep it a secret from their friends, as they didn't want to explain why a couple slacker dudes suddenly had so much money. Probably didn't want their fellow slackers hitting them up. There again, it could have been a fake story.

What's been bothering me for years isn't so much "fake" news as incomplete news. Remember that thread I started a few months ago about the San Onofre nuclear plant dumping their waste into the ocean? There has been zero follow-up on that. And we've been looking - my cousin and his family live near it, so they're especially interested. Have they given up on the idea, or are they just being quiet about it? Why even bring it up in the first place, other than to rile people up for a couple days before moving on? Same reason as those guys in Long Beach: sell some papers, make a few bucks.

Then there's the "news by omission" - whenever some ridiculous non-story dominates the news cycle, like a celebrity meltdown, I always think, what's going on that this is being used this to distract us from? That's misleading in a way that doesn't even bring attention to itself.

It's so easy to play the "outrage of the week" game. You could dig around and find some of the things that people were hopped up and hollering about six months ago, and you'd think, "Boy, I'd forgotten about that one. We sure thought it was a big deal at the time, though."

As for the threat of nuclear war, ask yourself if Trump or Putin really want that. What good would it do them? These people love power. Blow the world up, no more world to rule. I know that's a simplistic way of looking at it, but if you were in their position, would you do anything to compromise it? They may huff and puff for the cameras, but actually blow the house down and spoil their own fun?
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Jimbo
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby Jimbo » 24 Dec 2016, 15:13

zoomboogity wrote:
What's been bothering me for years isn't so much "fake" news as incomplete news. Remember that thread I started a few months ago about the San Onofre nuclear plant dumping their waste into the ocean? There has been zero follow-up on that.


Yes, that's true for the mainstream news sources but if you look at some site whose mission is to banish nuclear power, a site sure to be labeled as fake news because of the cheesy graphics mostly, you may find some of the truth you seek.

I've spent a good part of the last week at 21 Century Wire learning the truth about Syria and what a pack of lies the mainstream media has been feeding us. http://21stcenturywire.com And as bad as the lies are, equally bad are the omissions, the shit they don't say. They are at the top of the list printed at the Washington Post for fake news. Incidentally, they are at the top not because they are the most egregious fakers but because numbers come before letters in an alphabetical listing.
Last edited by Jimbo on 24 Dec 2016, 15:18, edited 1 time in total.
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yomptepi
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby yomptepi » 24 Dec 2016, 15:18

I am not sure it is deliberate. It is the nature of social media that news stories have become like Chinese Whispers. You start off with a story, which is inaccurately relayed to a third party, and then again to a fourth. And before you know it the story has changed beyond all recognition. The nature of twitter is to manufacture such rubbish. The internet is a giant mixer, and what goes in , rarely comes out unchanged. The fact that arguing using unsubstantiated internet memes is acceptable makes me so frustrated. Especially as people I know and usually respect often post up the most ridiculously stupid things. And the tiniest amount of research would make them reconsider. But it is all just too much trouble. Attention span zero is the problem.
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Jimbo
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby Jimbo » 24 Dec 2016, 15:30

yomptepi wrote:I am not sure it is deliberate. It is the nature of social media that news stories have become like Chinese Whispers.


But then note how the MSM news is so similar like they copy one another where The New York Times is the queen bee. You go to some alternative web site and it is an entirely different story. The alt web site is usually more skeptical of the government with their spokespersons and unidentified insiders the MSM seems to rely on. Has alternative news wrecked consumers view of the MSM? Polls say only like 15% of us trust the MSM. I will say this for The New York Times; they have some pretty good recipes.
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby Jimbo » 25 Dec 2016, 10:23



FYI, Chuck Todd is the top correspondent at NBC and he is just blathering about Putin and Trump is making good sense.
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby Jimbo » 25 Dec 2016, 11:06



I always wondered about this. Good thing ABC TV had their "TOP" investigative reporter on the job.
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby Jimbo » 27 Dec 2016, 08:37

Propaganda in a Democratic Society

by Aldous Huxley

(propaganda = not necessarily a lie -- information that is spread for the purpose of promoting some cause)

Propaganda in favor of action that is consonant (consistent) with enlightened self-interest appeals to reason by means of logical arguments based upon the best available evidence fully and honestly set forth.

Propaganda in favor of action dictated by the impulses that are below self-interest offers false, garbled or incomplete evidence, avoids logical argument and seeks to influence its victims by the mere repetition of catchwords, by the furious denunciation of foreign or domestic scapegoats, and by cunningly associating the lowest passions with the highest ideals, so that atrocities come to be perpetrated in the name of God and the most cynical kind of Realpolitik is treated as a matter of religious principle and patriotic duty.


Any of this ring a bell?
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The Great Defector
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby The Great Defector » 27 Dec 2016, 12:48

Who is gonna regulate it and decide what is fake news?
fueryIre wrote:Deluded by the belief that what is said on chat boards reflects reality or carries any kind of weight in the day-to-day world

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Jimbo
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby Jimbo » 27 Dec 2016, 13:52

The Great Defector wrote:Who is gonna regulate it and decide what is fake news?


That's the rub.

Change up here. This story is on Russia Today (a prime target for the "fake" label) about Aleppo.

Mass graves with dozens of bodies of civilians subjected to brutal torture have been discovered in Aleppo neighborhoods left by militants, the Russian Defense Ministry said Monday.

Many of the corpses were found with missing body parts, and most had gunshot wounds to the head, according to a statement by Russian Defense Ministry spokesman Major-General Igor Konashenkov.
https://www.rt.com/news/371824-aleppo-m ... civilians/

Gruesome news and quite a news story, especially important for Americans who have a lot invested in the Syria situation. Why, however, is there no mention of this in the New York Times nor on BBC? I'd imagine one look at the RT story and an NYT editor should go, "Holy shit! Lets get one of our reporters on the scene right away!" Or at least they should re-report this news crediting RT with the scoop.

But no. That's because the NYT and BBC and many more media outlets have been pumping out fake news favoring the absolutely mad US policy of driving out the Syrian president by funding, arming and training the same terrorists who supposedly brought down the WTC on 9/11. For a year the US news and government has been wringing its hands fretting for the civilians held as hostages in east Aleppo and now they are free. The world should rejoice. This may be the biggest hostage rescue in history. And now this horrible find by the Russians as reported above. Yes, the RT story could be a lie. Still, how many 1000s read the RT story? I think it would behoove a real, not fake, not lapdog media to confirm or debunk such a horrific and important story.

This is relevant because RT and its online supporters are the first to be blanked out as fake news. That leaves only the corporate mainstream media (FOX News, hello!) as legit news sources for the internet.

Now I won't say RT is an objective source of news. The big thing that besmirches their legitimacy is how they will do many stories which expose corruption and hypocrisy in the west but there are very few stories about the same in Russia. At the same time, they cover the US's dirty doings really well, things our own media won't report. Why? Because the US media is in the same boat as RT. Neither want to make trouble for their overlords.
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby Jimbo » 27 Dec 2016, 15:16

Jimbo wrote:

I always wondered about this. Good thing ABC TV had their "TOP" investigative reporter on the job.


The fake newsy part of this cowardly ABC report was that at the end the top investigative reporter had no idea where the Toyotas came. But I, with just a few clicks found out.

Just last year it was reported that the US State Department had been sending in fleets of specifically Toyota-brand trucks into Syria to whom they claimed was the “Free Syrian Army.”

US foundation-funded Public Radio International (PRI) reported in a 2014 article titled, “This one Toyota pickup truck is at the top of the shopping list for the Free Syrian Army — and the Taliban,” that:

Recently, when the US State Department resumed sending non-lethal aid to Syrian rebels, the delivery list included 43 Toyota trucks.

Hiluxes were on the Free Syrian Army’s wish list. Oubai Shahbander, a Washington-based advisor to the Syrian National Coalition, is a fan of the truck.

“Specific equipment like the Toyota Hiluxes are what we refer to as force enablers for the moderate opposition forces on the ground,” he adds. Shahbander says the US-supplied pickups will be delivering troops and supplies into battle. Some of the fleet will even become battlefield weapons..

The British government has also admittedly supplied a number of vehicles to terrorists fighting inside of Syria. The British Independent’s 2013 article titled, “Revealed: What the West has given Syria’s rebels,” reported that (emphasis added):

So far the UK has sent around £8m of “non-lethal” aid, according to official papers seen by The Independent, comprising five 4×4 vehicles with ballistic protection; 20 sets of body armour; four trucks (three 25 tonne, one 20 tonne); six 4×4 SUVs; five non-armoured pick-ups; one recovery vehicle; four fork-lifts; three advanced “resilience kits” for region hubs, designed to rescue people in emergencies; 130 solar powered batteries; around 400 radios; water purification and rubbish collection kits; laptops; VSATs (small satellite systems for data communications) and printers.
http://journal-neo.org/2015/10/09/the-m ... my-solved/
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Canis lupus
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby Canis lupus » 27 Dec 2016, 15:23

:arrow:

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Jimbo
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby Jimbo » 27 Dec 2016, 23:48

Colin Hugh wrote::arrow:


What does this mean? Seriously, what does the arrow pointing right mean?
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Jimbo
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby Jimbo » 28 Dec 2016, 03:48

Countering Foreign Propaganda and Disinformation Act
From Wikipedia

…The bipartisan bill was written in March 2016 by U.S. Senators Republican Rob Portman and Democrat Chris Murphy.[1] It was introduced by Senator Portman under its initial name Countering Information Warfare Act, on March 16, 2016 … the U.S. Congress would ask the United States Secretary of State to collaborate with the United States Secretary of Defense and other relevant Federal agencies to create a Global Engagement Center to fight against propaganda from foreign governments, and publicize the nature of ongoing foreign propaganda and disinformation operations against the U.S. and other countries.[10] The bill said this inter-agency effort should: "counter foreign propaganda and disinformation directed against United States national security interests and proactively advance fact-based narratives that support United States allies and interests."

Are they serious about clamping down on fake news or what? So much for freedom of speech. Now we have a real ministry of truth.
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby Jimbo » 25 Feb 2017, 05:28

Syrian War Propaganda at the Oscars
February 24, 2017

The Western-backed war in Syria, like the invasion of Iraq, was so smothered by propaganda that truth was not only the first casualty but has been steadily suffocated for five years, now reaching the Oscars, says Rick Sterling.


By Rick Sterling

The Netflix movie “The White Helmets” may win an Oscar in the “short documentary” category at the Academy Awards on Sunday. It would not be a surprise despite the fact that the group is a fraud and the movie is a contrived infomercial.

Awarding “The White Helmets” an Oscar would fit with the desire of Hollywood to appear supportive of “human rights,” even if that means supporting a propaganda operation to justify another bloody “regime change” war in the Middle East.

Much of what people think they know about the White Helmets is untrue. The group is not primarily Syrian; it was initiated by British military contractor James LeMesurier and has been heavily funded (about $100 million) by the U.S., U.K. and other governments. The White Helmets are not volunteers; they are paid, which is confirmed in a Al Jazeera video that shows some White Helmet “volunteers” talking about going on strike if they don’t get paid soon…
https://consortiumnews.com/2017/02/24/s ... he-oscars/

Beware fake news. More and more gaslighting. :x
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby fueryIre » 25 Feb 2017, 09:54

Presumably Consortium news is an example of the "fake news" sites you warn against because most of the issues the piece you quote addresses are covered in your old friend Wikipedia's page on TWH:


Political affiliation and funding[edit]

SCD is officially a neutral and impartial humanitarian NGO, with no official affiliation to any political or military actor and a commitment to render services to any in need regardless of sect or political affiliation.[18] Like all NGOs operating in opposition-controlled areas, SCD negotiates humanitarian access with organizations such as local councils, provincial councils, and armed groups, with relationships varying widely from governorate to governorate.[1]

SCD has been accused by supporters of Bashar Al-Assad and the Russian Federation of supporting humanitarian military intervention in Syria to protect Syrian civilians against indiscriminate SyAAF and Russian Air Force bombardment. In September 2014, the SCD delegation to the United Nations General Assembly argued that United States airstrikes should target Syrian government targets as well as ISIS and Al-Qaeda-linked groups.[26][27] In May 2015 the head of SCD Raed Saleh and the head of Mayday Rescue James Le Mesurier met with some United Nations Security Council and European Union diplomats to argue for the enforcement of a no-fly zone over parts of Syria.[27][28][29] The case for a no-fly zone was also made at a United Nations General Assembly side meeting in September 2015.[30]

Mayday Rescue's Program Manager for Syria is Farouq Habib,[31][32] who is also described as the White Helmets' Head of International Relations.[33]

SCD is not affiliated to the International Civil Defence Organisation, nor is it connected to the Syrian Civil Defence Forces which have been a member of the ICDO since 1972. However, as the Syrian government's civil defense organisation does not operate in rebel-held areas, and bombardment of civilian populations in Syria is overwhelmingly perpetrated against opposition-held areas by Syrian government forces, SCD is significantly more experienced in the 15 core civil defense tasks as defined in IHL than is the Syrian government's civil defense force (which essentially functions as a conventional peacetime fire and rescue service).[34][35][36]

Funding[edit]
SCD is supported by the aid agencies of a number of external donor governments. Initially the United Kingdom Foreign and Commonwealth Office was the largest single source of funding through the Netherlands-based NGO Mayday Rescue Foundation.[37]

Funders now include the Canadian government Peace and Stabilization Operations Program,[32] the Danish government,[38][39] the German government,[40] the Japan International Cooperation Agency,[6][41] the Netherlands Ministry of Foreign Affairs.[42][43] the New Zealand Ministry of Foreign Affairs,[44] the United States Agency for International Development (USAID)[21] and the United Kingdom Conflict, Stability and Security Fund (CSSF).[45] USAID now appears to be the largest donor, having contributed at least $23 million from 2013 to March 2016.[46][47] The British government had provided £15 million of funding between 2012 and November 2015,[48] increased to £32 million by October 2016.[49]

"We do not hide it, we admit [that] there is funding from the USA, from the UK, from Germany, from Netherlands,” Abdulrahman Al Mawwas, the chief liaison officer of the White Helmets said in 2016.[50]

As of 2016, SCD state they are also partly funded through Chemonics, a U.S. based private international development company.[51]

The SCD has also received individual donations online to their Hero Fund, which provides treatment for wounded volunteers and supports their families.[52]

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Jimbo
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby Jimbo » 25 Feb 2017, 11:19

I assume you were too lazy again to open the link and read the article. If you had then you could see any number of things that would make a curious person wonder if there isn't something to the story. But you … nah. I did read the Wilipedia and all those millions and millions in donations. Man that kind of cabbage can buy some top line video gear.

Speaking of which, to see how helpful (bogus) the White Helmets are check out this very short video. Very realistic, especially after the director signals "Action!"

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Re: "Fake News"

Postby PresMuffley » 25 Feb 2017, 11:40

Just wanted to thank you for changing the pic in your signature. I was starting to hate Rodney Dangerfield.
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby fueryIre » 25 Feb 2017, 12:31

[quote="Jimbo"]I assume you were too lazy again to open the link and read the article. If you had then you could see any number of things that would make a curious person wonder if there isn't something to the story. But you … nah. I did read the Wilipedia and all those millions and millions in donations. Man that kind of cabbage can buy some top line video gear.

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"Too lazy" - not as credulous as Jimbo

"Curious person" - a completely credulous halfwit - rather like Jimbo himself
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Re: "Fake News"

Postby PresMuffley » 25 Feb 2017, 13:07

Fake news is far from new and it wouldn't be an issue if there weren't so many gullible dopes. Maybe a bit of education would help, but I doubt it.
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