How will you vote on AV

in reality, all of this has been a total load of old bollocks

How will you vote on AV

Yes
32
76%
No
5
12%
Unsure
1
2%
Won't Vote/Don't care
4
10%
Footy
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 42

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the hanging monkey
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby the hanging monkey » 06 May 2011, 10:07

Libs getting thrashed in the council elections.
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Deebank
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby Deebank » 06 May 2011, 10:14

the hanging monkey wrote:Libs getting thrashed in the council elections.



Utterly fucked :lol:

I can't believe that the tories got away relatively unscathed. People are so dim. It's tory policies they don't like but they seem to want to punish Clegg for supporting them rather than Cameron for insisting on them. :roll:

Scotland aside it was Labour's night on the whole - and they deserve to get a kicking in Jockland for having such a dull, uncharismatic leader. Anyone that Makes Alex Salmond look interesting is a bit of a joke.
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Belle Lettre
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby Belle Lettre » 06 May 2011, 10:19

It's a constant wonder to me that people can't see through Tories. Not to mention a source of despair.
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dang65
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby dang65 » 06 May 2011, 10:43

Deebank wrote:I can't believe that the tories got away relatively unscathed. People are so dim. It's tory policies they don't like but they seem to want to punish Clegg for supporting them rather than Cameron for insisting on them. :roll:

Isn't it the case that at the general election a lot of people wanted to register a protest against Labour (for some reason or other) but specifically did not want the Tories in government, so they voted Lib Dem. The Lib Dems then went into coalition, allowing the Tories to take dominant joint power, effectively meaning that all those people who voted Lib Dem might as well have voted Tory. D'oh!

Those people are now enraged (as I would be if I had voted Lib Dem) and have not voted Lib Dem this time. I don't suppose the Tories have picked up many Lib Dem votes, but they'll have kept their own votes, and people are still reluctant to vote Labour. Not sure who the Lib Dem votes went to. Maybe a lot of those people just didn't vote at all?

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Deebank
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby Deebank » 06 May 2011, 10:45

dang65 wrote:
Deebank wrote:I can't believe that the tories got away relatively unscathed. People are so dim. It's tory policies they don't like but they seem to want to punish Clegg for supporting them rather than Cameron for insisting on them. :roll:

Isn't it the case that at the general election a lot of people wanted to register a protest against Labour (for some reason or other) but specifically did not want the Tories in government, so they voted Lib Dem. The Lib Dems then went into coalition, allowing the Tories to take dominant joint power, effectively meaning that all those people who voted Lib Dem might as well have voted Tory. D'oh!

Those people are now enraged (as I would be if I had voted Lib Dem) and have not voted Lib Dem this time. I don't suppose the Tories have picked up many Lib Dem votes, but they'll have kept their own votes, and people are still reluctant to vote Labour. Not sure who the Lib Dem votes went to. Maybe a lot of those people just didn't vote at all?


That seems logical. I suspect you're right.
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the hanging monkey
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby the hanging monkey » 06 May 2011, 11:16

Yup, I was just going to post something similar.

Assuming the AV outcome is "no", then surely the Libs have got to dissolve the coalition? It's killing them.
Last edited by the hanging monkey on 06 May 2011, 11:25, edited 1 time in total.
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dang65
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby dang65 » 06 May 2011, 11:24

dang65 wrote:Not sure who the Lib Dem votes went to. Maybe a lot of those people just didn't vote at all?

Actually, looks like a lot of the votes did go back to Labour. From the BBC site:

Code: Select all

PARTY    COUNCILS    +/-    COUNCILLORS    +/-
CON      55          +1     1470           +37
LAB      29          +12    1004           +339
LD       4           -4     340            -295
OTH      21          -9     193            -100

Or am I reading that wrong?

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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby Corporate whore » 06 May 2011, 11:31

the hanging monkey wrote:Yup, I was just going to post something similar.

Assuming the AV outcome is "no", then surely the Libs have got to dissolve the coalition? It's killing them.


Or at least start playing hardball - nothing to lose now. We are entering interesting times.
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby Penk! » 06 May 2011, 11:36

Belle Lettre wrote:It's a constant wonder to me that people can't see through Tories. Not to mention a source of despair.


Oh, I don't know if that's the case. I think there are a lot of people out there who see the Tories for what they are... and like it.
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the hanging monkey
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby the hanging monkey » 06 May 2011, 11:48

Yes but how many people are better off under the Tories? 10% max?
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby Deebank » 06 May 2011, 12:06

the hanging monkey wrote:Yes but how many people are better off under the Tories? 10% max?


Maybe...

I hope we're not turning into the USA (no offence my collonial pals! ;) ) in that the majority of the population believes in a dream whereby they one day make their fortune (on the lottery or whatever) and so they have to keep things cushy for the super rich just in case.
The USA has the lowest social mobility in the developed world - and we're not far behind.
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby Moleskin » 06 May 2011, 12:11

dang65 wrote:
Those people are now enraged (as I would be if I had voted Lib Dem) and have not voted Lib Dem this time. I don't suppose the Tories have picked up many Lib Dem votes, but they'll have kept their own votes, and people are still reluctant to vote Labour. Not sure who the Lib Dem votes went to. Maybe a lot of those people just didn't vote at all?


Turnout here was 58%. So not a ringing endorsement for the venal tories that control the council, and will take this as an assent to closing all our libraries and spending all our money on a vanity-project new council building
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dang65
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby dang65 » 06 May 2011, 12:13

Deebank wrote:the majority of the population believes in a dream whereby they one day make their fortune (on the lottery or whatever) and so they have to keep things cushy for the super rich just in case.

That's brilliant! Plus, don't forget that any one of us can marry into the Royal Family now, thanks to Princess Kate. It makes a lot of sense to protect the rich in any way we can. 8-)

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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby Thesiger » 06 May 2011, 12:24

Belle Lettre wrote:It's a constant wonder to me that people can't see through Tories. Not to mention a source of despair.


Doubtless, it's false consciousness.
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby Corporate whore » 06 May 2011, 12:26

Deebank wrote:The USA has the lowest social mobility in the developed world - and we're not far behind.


You need to be careful with that argument, socal mobility was at a peak under the Thatcher government.....
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Belle Lettre
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby Belle Lettre » 06 May 2011, 12:28

Thesiger wrote:
Belle Lettre wrote:It's a constant wonder to me that people can't see through Tories. Not to mention a source of despair.


Doubtless, it's false consciousness.


D'you reckon? :D
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dang65
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby dang65 » 06 May 2011, 12:44

The figures on the BBC News site look more and more like a huge Labour comeback to me (at least in England). +14 councils and +366 councillors compared with Conservatives +3 and +43 respectively. But I'm not seeing any mention of that success. If anything, people are saying it's disappointing for Labour. How does that work then?

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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby copehead » 06 May 2011, 13:06

corporate whore wrote:
Deebank wrote:The USA has the lowest social mobility in the developed world - and we're not far behind.


You need to be careful with that argument, socal mobility was at a peak under the Thatcher government.....


hmmm

http://cep.lse.ac.uk/pubs/download/cp263.pdf


As far as we can tell, therefore, it
seems that our previous finding of a fall in
intergenerational mobility between the
1958 and 1970 cohorts will not continue
for children born more recently. Looking at
the connection between intervening
factors - educational attainment, test
scores and behavioural measures - and
family income for more recent cohorts we
find little evidence of change.
It appears that the decline in social
mobility may well have flattened out. This
may be either good or bad news for policy:
while it may have stopped the previous
decline, it has failed to lead to an overall
improvement in mobility.


Social mobility seems to have peaked in the egalitarian period immediately post war, when I imagine many of our parents made good from modest starts, an then dropped from the late 50s to the early 70s and has rumbled along at around that level ever since.

Sill not that great, butt here are many studies that show that more egalitarian, often called the Norsdic model, societies do better on most measuresand the wider the gap between rich and poor becomes the sicker society as a whole becomes.

It would seem to be a bit obvious that that would be the case but I suppose the case has to be made with evidence and a quick google search will provide that.

It helps to have a shit load of oil lke Norway and not to spunk it all on keeping millions unemployed in a nationwide social experiment in creating an underclass as we did
Last edited by copehead on 06 May 2011, 13:13, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby copehead » 06 May 2011, 13:09

dang65 wrote:The figures on the BBC News site look more and more like a huge Labour comeback to me (at least in England). +14 councils and +366 councillors compared with Conservatives +3 and +43 respectively. But I'm not seeing any mention of that success. If anything, people are saying it's disappointing for Labour. How does that work then?


It's what happens when the BBC TV News' politics and economics departments are taken over by a Tory cabal
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Belle Lettre
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Re: How will you vote on AV

Postby Belle Lettre » 06 May 2011, 13:13

I suppose Yomp will be along shortly?
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