The Conversation

..and why not?
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Davey the Fat Boy
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Re: The Conversation

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 20 Jan 2018, 21:06

The Modernist wrote:It's not nearly as good as The Godfather or Apocalypse Now, although it's always been the film snob's Coppola film of choice.

It is interesting on a cerebral level, but slightly less successful dramatically where it's let down by a certain flatness or coldness. I should say I do regard it as being a very good film however.



That’s the film snob snob’s take. ;)

I think it’s better than Apocalypse Now but not as good as either Godfather film.
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K
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Re: The Conversation

Postby K » 20 Jan 2018, 21:27

It's a bit unfair comparing anything to the first two Godfather films!

I agree with Davey. The Conversation is tighter than Apocalypse Now. AN startles on first viewing, especially if you are young, but The Conversation is the more mature piece of work.
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the masked man
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Re: The Conversation

Postby the masked man » 20 Jan 2018, 21:40

The Godfather is too morally compromised; it glamorises the Mob and is suspect for that reason. It's slick but morally empty. But it's a big, glossy Hollywood production, undoubtedly well-made, so everyone gives it an easy ride. Apocalypse Now is more complicated. It's impressive, but I get the feeling that Coppola had no idea what he was doing (the documentary Hearts of Darkness confirms this); there are longueurs, but it's more an intriguing oddity than a genuine masterpiece.

But The Conversation is something else altogether. It's not like a classical American movie at all. It's dark and bleak, like some eastern European film, and it follows the unravelling of a flawed man with total dedication. The final scenes are utterly devastating. It's Coppola's only masterpiece, as he understood exactly what he was doing. There, I've said it!

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The Modernist
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Re: The Conversation

Postby The Modernist » 21 Jan 2018, 11:49

I'll need to watch it again I think, but it doesn't have the sheer sweep and memorability of the other two films.

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Davey the Fat Boy
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Re: The Conversation

Postby Davey the Fat Boy » 21 Jan 2018, 15:25

the masked man wrote:The Godfather is too morally compromised; it glamorises the Mob and is suspect for that reason. It's slick but morally empty. But it's a big, glossy Hollywood production, undoubtedly well-made, so everyone gives it an easy ride.


I REALLY disagree with this!

I’m not even sure that “morally compromised” (or not) is a terribly meaningful concept for me in determining a film’s value. But regardless - I don’t think The Godfather is even concerned with the notion of whether organized crime is glamorous or not. It takes an insular view of the Corleone family and uses them to make larger observations about America itself.

I judge it on those terms. It certainly holds up as a masterpiece to me.
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The Modernist
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Re: The Conversation

Postby The Modernist » 21 Jan 2018, 17:43

Neither is it particularly 'glossy' or 'slick'. I mean these are the kind of adjectives you choose when you want to say something about the superficiality of Hollywood, but they don't seem very applicable here and so it seems quite a lazy critique. The cinematography in the film is actually quite dark and muted.