The Manchester United Thread

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The Modernist
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby The Modernist » 23 Aug 2018, 12:51

Tonto Papadopoulos wrote:He's lost the dressing room though, G. The echoes of Chelsea a few years ago are unmistakable. .


Well strictly speaking that's also incorrect. What you're saying is a prediction not a fact. Chelsea's bad form continued for a couple of months and then he was sacked. United's bad form has lasted for one game so far.
I'm not saying it will end well for Mourinho at United, I don't think it will either, but it's premature to talk as if he's already been sacked..he hasn't.

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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby The Modernist » 23 Aug 2018, 13:19

For what it's worth, at this point, I think the most likely scenario is that he'll be replaced at the end of the season.

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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Diamond Dog » 23 Aug 2018, 14:46

If Mourinho goes before Christmas, I think they'd go for someone like Zidane. They may even favour him over Pocchetino at the end of the season. I'm sure Poccchetino would jump at the chance, were it offered.
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Diamond Dog » 24 Aug 2018, 15:46

Diamond Dog wrote: It's so obvious there is a power play going on there right now - with Pogba clearly leading the charge for change. His post match interview was really telling - when asked what Mourinho had said at half time he started to answer and then smiled coyly and said "I don't like answering - you'll need to ask him". Almost like he just remembered in time the 'agreed process' and stop himself ... and let Mourinho hang himself.


And Mourinho today, in a very terse press conference, gave his response.... when asked about the Pogba comment above, his response ? "I don't like to talk for others, you'd need to ask him "... (I paraphrase the exact wording).

Eye for an eye..... :lol:
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby KeithPratt » 27 Aug 2018, 21:29

“Relax lads, it’s Spurs!”

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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Diamond Dog » 27 Aug 2018, 22:37

Diamond Dog wrote: I'm sure Poccchetino would jump at the chance, were it offered.


Or maybe not :)
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby The Modernist » 27 Aug 2018, 23:17

He rejigged the defence for tonight's game, but obviously to no avail. A supposedly sound defence has been their main strength under Mourinho, so if that goes he's in big trouble as they're never going to be free scoring.

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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Diamond Dog » 28 Aug 2018, 06:15

The Modernist wrote:He rejigged the defence for tonight's game, but obviously to no avail. A supposedly sound defence has been their main strength under Mourinho, so if that goes he's in big trouble as they're never going to be free scoring.


I think for the first time I can remember in English football, he looks tactically shot at the moment. He's becoming the new "tinker man", never picking the same players or formations or tactics. And he can clearly blame the central defenders last night, without actually doing so, and say he never bought those...but he did spend over £60 million on Bailly and Lindelof and they were equally as bad last week (and were both dropped this week). Who knows where he got the idea to play Herrera as a centre back in a three, or Pogba (I think) right of a top two/three. To be honest when, after 90 minutes, no one quite knows exactly what formation they did actually play - or who filled which roles within that- then it suggests they were a shambles. Which they were.

I think in the walk off the pitch and the interview afterwards I saw an emotion I don't recall from Jose last nght - fear. Pure naked fear. I think he knows it's only a matter of time before the Man Utd experiment is over - and he'll go as a failure. A failure that wasted a huge amount of money on decidedly average players and never got them to perform. And set a few promising youngsters back too - maybe irreparably. The first real blot on his management CV.

One last thing - Ed Woodward is not coming out of this with any credit either. The press briefing that completely undermined Mourinho on the eve of the first match, and the sulking/scowling/shaking of the head in the stands (quite clearly for the benefit of the cameras/the Glazer's) has been absolutely appalling. Hopefully he'll get sent on his way too - but I very much doubt that, because he makes loads of money for the club/the Glazer's. And that seems to be all that matters.
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Penk! » 28 Aug 2018, 06:21

They lost because Pogba has started dying his hair again. There’s a clear negative correlation between the outlandishness of his hair and the level of his performance. When he won the World Cup in summer, he did it with a plain, natural buzzcut.
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Diamond Dog » 28 Aug 2018, 07:49

Crucially, there is that too.
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Diamond Dog » 28 Aug 2018, 09:20

Tonto Papadopoulos wrote:"Respect, respect, respect!"


https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/45325398

:lol:
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Lord Rother » 28 Aug 2018, 09:28

I said at the time of his appointment that it was a terrible decision that would quickly have the likes of Bobby Charlton shaking their heads, but how quickly he has become a dinosaur is incredible.

But the evidence has been there for all to see. To their cost Man Utd couldn’t see it at the time and have been slow to react which has done so much damage and cost them so much money.

2 years ago Lord Rother wrote:
I seriously think he's finished. And I think he knows it too.

I suspect he'll be out of Man Utd before the end of the season.

The other players will be seriously unimpressed that he has specifically singled out Shaw for criticism and Ashley Young for praise whilst suggesting most of them can't handle the pressure of playing for Man Utd. Most will be seriously unimpressed that he is persisting with Rooney in a position he is ineffective in, thus completely blunting Pogbalotelli's potential.

I appreciate that it isn't essential for players to like their manager, but it is absolutely imperative that they respect him. The Man Utd players will have lost a lot of respect for him over that. Bloody hard to get it back, if not impossible. Chelsea players lost all respect for him after the Eva Caneiro scandal, and his treatment of John Terry, and singling out Hazard amongst others.

Mourinho knew he was finished at Chelsea before he was shown the door. Jason Cundy has said he knows for a fact that Jose told the board "its over, I can't turn this around..."

The fact he has waltzed into Man Utd and repeated the mistakes is fairly astonishing but totally indicative of a guy who has lost it.

The self-hype and ego have completely overtaken good sense, pragmatism and patience.

He is finished as a top club manager but will doubtless soon be reinventing himself as an international manager. Probably have worked his way down to Qatar by the time they host the World Cup.

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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Diamond Dog » 28 Aug 2018, 09:44

Diamond Dog wrote:Opinion, not fact. Just as mine is opinion, not fact.

As I said, if Man Utd are in such need that they have to qualify for the CL, then Mourinho should be the man (though I very much doubt he would have got Chelsea there this season).

My issue is whether the option to replace LVG with Jose is, in fact, a better long term appointment for the club. I happen to think, based on what we know thus far, it may well not be. I'm not certain, because maybe this particular leopard can change his spots, but I remain unconvinced of that.

It may be that he does enough in two two or three seasons he is there to justify the decision - maybe he will steady the ship, make CL qualification a relatively straightforward thing, and pass on a resurgent club to his successor, with the youth policy thriving and the fans happy with the style of football being played. That is a possibility, in which case the risk was justified.

However, the overtures being made to Zlatan - from Mourinho himself, maybe?- suggest a guy ready to come in, buy extremely expensive, senior players, to gain victory now. If Zlatan does go there, where does that leave Rashford and Martial? Two players who really want first team football to thrive and who were probably looking to compete for the lone striker role. If Zlatan arrives, how much football are they going to see in that position, realistically? You know, I know and they know (because the whole world knows) that Mourinho is never going to play two up top.... think about that.

Of course, as Toby suggests, maybe Jose really is ready to settle down and build the club in the long term. I'm merely suggesting (in the previous fifteen years) he has never given the slightest inkling that the club's long term success is his motivator. I see no reason to believe his modus operandi will change - that's based on his career thus far, not some pipe dream/wish.

Here's a question - We go through 2016-17 & 2017-18...and we get into the New Year of 2019........ do you think Mourinho will still be at Man Utd, looking at players in that transfer window? And, whether he is or not, how many players do you think he will have playing at Old Trafford under the age of 22?

I fully understand the loathing of LVG. I just think what he has achieved is being under-estimated. He took a club in disarray and who had a shocking defence. He got them into the CL at the first time of asking and very narrowly missed out this year. He won an FA Cup. He made Man United as good as there is defensively in the EPL. He brought through four or five young, talented players for the future. He was clearly working on a three year plan - who knows what would have happened offensively next year?

As you know, I'm not a Man Utd fan. But I have no hatchet to bury with the club. I'm just giving an honest opinion of the change of manager. In my eyes, Man Utd have embarked on a high risk strategy with a manager whose history suggests he isn't a long term solution, that is all.


From May 24th 2016.
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Diamond Dog » 28 Aug 2018, 13:19

Actually if you go back to around May 23rd 2016 of this thread (for me, it's page 112) you'll find some really insightful comments regarding Mourinho's (what was then) anticipated appointment, and what effect it will have on the club.

And you'll also get the opportunity to see Jimboo making a complete and utter tit of himself, in defence of the mighty Jose.

Honestly - it's a good read.
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Diamond Dog » 28 Aug 2018, 16:33

Another thing (while we're here).... maybe Jose should have said to Woodward pre-season "Listen Ed - I know I say I want that Brazilian midfielder Fred but, in reality, the position I really need strengthening is centre back. Yes I know I spent £60+ million there last season but, well I have to confess - it just hasn't worked out. So - here's a list of five centre backs... I desperately need at least one but, if to get two I have to sell one of the five I currently have, then I'm happy to do so. Fred's going to cost £60 millm, so that's the budget. I stress - the centre back position is where I really need to strengthen. I can do without another anonymous midfielder, especially for £60 mill. Got that?"

Maybe he would have got his beloved centre back(s) then - and maybe even have shipped out one (or two) of the ramshackle mob he has in that position at the moment into the bargain.

See that seems like good business to me - a bit of compromise. But do you think that ever entered his mind? Nah, thought not.

By the way - Fred. £60 million. Just think about that.
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Lord Rother » 28 Aug 2018, 17:41

Looks shit to me but there’s probably a good player in there that won’t come out while shackled by Mourinho’s management.

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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Diamond Dog » 28 Aug 2018, 19:00

Lord Rother wrote:Looks shit to me but there’s probably a good player in there that won’t come out while shackled by Mourinho’s management.


Maybe. But Mahrez or Fred for £60 million - which do you fancy?
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Lord Rother » 28 Aug 2018, 20:18

Hmmm.

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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Diamond Dog » 28 Aug 2018, 20:41

BREAKING NEWS. Old Trafford is being renamed the O3 Arena.
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Re: The Manchester United Thread

Postby Lord Rother » 29 Sep 2018, 22:24

Mourinho and Pogbalotelli - a fantastic double act that is generating belly laughs across large swathes of the country.

The Glazers tend to be very loyal to their managers, only getting rid at end of season (or in Moyes’ case when mathematical chances of qualifying for the CL had gone (I think)) so we may we’ll have 6 more months of this fun.

I’m not sure football was supposed to be THAT much fun.


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