World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

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Diamond Dog
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby Diamond Dog » 15 Jul 2018, 17:04

Two terrible decisions.

But appalling defending at the free kick from Croatia.
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby Darkness_Fish » 15 Jul 2018, 17:15

joklend wrote:I've seen far worse handball decisions than that. Shrugs.

As long as worse decisions have been made, I guess it doesn't matter...
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby PENK » 15 Jul 2018, 17:21

Darkness_Fish wrote:
joklend wrote:I've seen far worse handball decisions than that. Shrugs.

As long as worse decisions have been made, I guess it doesn't matter...


Yes, Croatia will sleep much better knowing their World Cup Final defeat was just down to a demonstrably wrong decision but not the worst decision in history.
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby PENK » 15 Jul 2018, 17:26

This is a shame. France do not deserve this and had they not been handed the lead just before half-time, they wouldn’t be getting these opportunities as Croatia chase the game.

Subasic arguably at fault for all the goals, mind.
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby joklend » 15 Jul 2018, 17:28

Was it completely demonstrably wrong? I can understand why it was given.

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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby PENK » 15 Jul 2018, 17:28

PENK wrote:Subasic arguably at fault for all the goals, mind.


Perhaps Lloris wanted to show some solidarity? :lol:
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby Darkness_Fish » 15 Jul 2018, 17:28

Which keeper has been paid the most to throw this game?
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby Diamond Dog » 15 Jul 2018, 17:30

joklend wrote:Was it completely demonstrably wrong? I can understand why it was given.


Actually that's completely the wrong argument isn't it - literally. The decision wasn't given - the VAR had to show that decision was demonstrably wrong.
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby PENK » 15 Jul 2018, 17:31

joklend wrote:Was it completely demonstrably wrong? I can understand why it was given.


Because VAR is by definition to be used to correct ”clear and obvious errors”. It can be proved that this was not a ”clear and obvious error” due to the time needed to change the decision, the uncertainty of many viewers, commentators and experts on the decision, and the impossibility of knowing Perisic’s precise intention.

It was, therefore, demonstrably wrong to change the decision on the VAR evidence.
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby joklend » 15 Jul 2018, 17:49

Diamond Dog wrote:
joklend wrote:Was it completely demonstrably wrong? I can understand why it was given.


Actually that's completely the wrong argument isn't it - literally. The decision wasn't given - the VAR had to show that decision was demonstrably wrong.


But he didn't make a decision. The VAR was predicated on the referee not seeing it.

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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby Diamond Dog » 15 Jul 2018, 17:51

joklend wrote:
Diamond Dog wrote:
joklend wrote:Was it completely demonstrably wrong? I can understand why it was given.


Actually that's completely the wrong argument isn't it - literally. The decision wasn't given - the VAR had to show that decision was demonstrably wrong.


But he didn't make a decision. The VAR was predicated on the referee not seeing it.


And took five minutes to decide. And went back just to make sure. Does that really sound like a referee who is absolutely convinced his original decision was demonstrably incorrect?
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby joklend » 15 Jul 2018, 17:51

PENK wrote:
joklend wrote:Was it completely demonstrably wrong? I can understand why it was given.


Because VAR is by definition to be used to correct ”clear and obvious errors”. It can be proved that this was not a ”clear and obvious error” due to the time needed to change the decision, the uncertainty of many viewers, commentators and experts on the decision, and the impossibility of knowing Perisic’s precise intention.

It was, therefore, demonstrably wrong to change the decision on the VAR evidence.


The time taken is not necessarily relevant and the ref does not have the liberty of everything else you mention.

Sure it was contentious, I just don't see the level of outrage.

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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby Diamond Dog » 15 Jul 2018, 17:53

Diamond Dog wrote:On May 6th some clueless fucktard wrote this :

Diamond Dog wrote:I'm beginning to get vibes about France.


And then, on May 21st ,some bright spark wrote this :

Diamond Dog wrote:The ones to avoid in the office sweep is France - I've just had a tenner each way on them at 11/2 ...............


May as well live up to my tagline.....



You heard it here first. :lol:
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby PENK » 15 Jul 2018, 18:02

Congratulations to France, anyway. After a creaky start they have probably been the best team over the knockout stages and deserve the title, even if the controversial goals and their iffy performance in the final leave a slightly sour taste.
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby Toby » 15 Jul 2018, 18:18

They won in a German manner.

They didn't always play particularly well, but they had quality in all positions and in Pogba, Varane and Mbappe they had a trio of superb players who could impose themselves in big games. I'm reminded of West Germany in 1990 with Brehme, Matthaus and Klinsmann. Plus of course a coach who had been there and won it as a player.

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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby Diamond Dog » 15 Jul 2018, 18:41

They were the best team in the tournament, whilst rarely really showing their full potential.

Which is scary when you consider just how young they are and the players they have on their bench (or left at home).
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby The Modernist » 15 Jul 2018, 18:47

joklend wrote:
PENK wrote:
joklend wrote:Was it completely demonstrably wrong? I can understand why it was given.


Because VAR is by definition to be used to correct ”clear and obvious errors”. It can be proved that this was not a ”clear and obvious error” due to the time needed to change the decision, the uncertainty of many viewers, commentators and experts on the decision, and the impossibility of knowing Perisic’s precise intention.

It was, therefore, demonstrably wrong to change the decision on the VAR evidence.


The time taken is not necessarily relevant and the ref does not have the liberty of everything else you mention.

Sure it was contentious, I just don't see the level of outrage.


It was the wrong decision, a basic error and you would expect better from a referee who is meant to be one of the world's best.
He gave it because he chose to interpret the downward motion of the arm as 'deliberate'. But the reason the arm was moving downwards was because the player was landing - it's a basic natural movement, no one lands with their hands still pointing in the air. It's just common sense to understand, but sometimes in highly pressurized situations common sense goes missing.

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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby The Modernist » 15 Jul 2018, 18:49

Toby wrote: and in Pogba, Varane and Mbappe they had a trio of superb players who could impose themselves in big games.


Griezmann goes under the radar, but I thought he was excellent too. He knits everything together in the final third.

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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby borofan » 15 Jul 2018, 18:51

Lord Rother wrote: Wilshere had played regularly and was England’s MOTM in 6 of his last 7 matches.

In whose opinion? I certainly can't remember any outstanding performances from him.
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Re: World Cup 2018 - Rossiya

Postby The Modernist » 15 Jul 2018, 19:08

I'd say there was a lot more to France than a rather negative team. They were just so clinical in the way they chose their moments. It is to the tremendous credit of Croatia that they pushed them as far as they did, I think they were the only team that had France in real difficulty.