FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Pansy Puff » 06 Jun 2015, 21:37

'skope wrote:
K wrote:
'skope wrote:you sicken me. to my very bcb core.

get a grip pete, and take another holiday to reflect upon your bnp mentality.


"I don't believe in positive discrimination" said the Ukip leader, adding "the other political parties have all-female shortlists - we don't.

"We treat people on merit and that's a fairer and better system."


it seems like you have a little bcb bummer-boy, pete.

engage and enjoy the blow-off.


Homophobic and racist. You are a piece of work.
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Diamond Dog » 06 Jun 2015, 21:46

So that would still be you unable/unwilling to provide an answer to a very simple question then. Again.

You are a blowhard, who has been shown up for exactly what you are a - racist homophobe.

Now fuck off and find some meat eaters to pick on, you clueless, witless, artless twat.
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby 'skope » 06 Jun 2015, 21:47

Diamond Dog wrote:
You are a blowhard, who has been shown up for exactly what you are a - racist homophobe.

Now fuck off and find some meat eaters to pick on, you clueless, witless, artless twat.


is that really the best you can do, pete. really?

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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Vic Snazell-Sprey » 06 Jun 2015, 22:05

'skope wrote:
Diamond Dog wrote:Either you're suggesting the black guys are too lazy and/or stupid to qualify as coaches/progress to management.


jeez :roll:

come back to this thread when you've got something constructive to say, pete.



No, he's bang on the money.
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Vic Snazell-Sprey » 06 Jun 2015, 22:15

(sorry, I'm lagging behind with this thread, but here goes....)

'skope wrote:rio at west ham, king at spurs, henry at arsenal, makalele at chelsea. i'm sure that if any of them had the desire and skills to manage, they would be welcomed with open arms by both the fans and the owners to step up to the plate.


Interesting. Perhaps by a large (though not as large as if they'd been white) section of the fans but, almost certainly, not fancied much by the powers-that-be at those clubs. The underlying racism within our society (one part of which is: Black people aren't quite as trustworthy as whites in positions of power or, if you fancy another one, the owners don't quite trust the players to take a bollocking off a black guy) seems to be holding non-white would-be-managers back.
Last edited by Vic Snazell-Sprey on 06 Jun 2015, 22:19, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby 'skope » 06 Jun 2015, 22:16

Mabel Griff's Toyshop wrote:
'skope wrote:
Diamond Dog wrote:Either you're suggesting the black guys are too lazy and/or stupid to qualify as coaches/progress to management.


jeez :roll:

come back to this thread when you've got something constructive to say, pete.



No, he's bang on the money.


is he, andrew? is he really?

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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Vic Snazell-Sprey » 06 Jun 2015, 22:16

Diamond Dog wrote:Far from it. I followed this closely in American Football, back when there wasn't a black head coach in the NFL. And those that said it was 'just a coincidence' used similar arguments - why didn't black guys get to be Quarterbacks (the position most likely to be associated with advancement to Head Coach at the time)? The same lazy arguments you are (surreptitiously) forwarding - re non whites % of coaching credentials. Exactly the same prejudiced views, with exactly similar results. Until they introduced The Rooney rule - whereby each head coaching/ co-ordinator position had to have at least one minority candidate interviewed.

Have a guess what - the level of minority coaches shot up, almost instantaneously. Why do you think that was? Because the non whites saw at least a semblance of a level playing field, and took the opportunity - instead of being debarred as a matter of course.


Bingo.
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Vic Snazell-Sprey » 06 Jun 2015, 22:18

K wrote:Then the only possible explanation is that black people are less competent than white people.


Yep. Or just thicker. Or less trustworthy.
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Pansy Puff » 06 Jun 2015, 22:22

Mabel Griff's Toyshop wrote:
K wrote:Then the only possible explanation is that black people are less competent than white people.


Yep. Or just thicker. Or less trustworthy.


However, many of my favourite musicians are black. They certainly make for good entertainers.
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Vic Snazell-Sprey » 06 Jun 2015, 22:25

'skope wrote:pete, before we can even begin to debate this we must establish how many potential black managers are applying for positions and who they are up against.


How many black players don't even bother though because they know they're unlikely to get the gig anyway and, even if they do, they'll probably come up against all sorts of institutional and cultural racism as soon as they sit in the dug-out?

I'm surprised at you, Adam. Is it that hard to envisage?
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Vic Snazell-Sprey » 06 Jun 2015, 22:26

K wrote:However, many of my favourite musicians are black. They certainly make for good entertainers.


It's their sense of rhythm. And their care-free attitude to life.
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Vic Snazell-Sprey » 06 Jun 2015, 22:32

K wrote:Homophobic and racist. You are a piece of work.


It has to be noted, you are not covering yourself in glory on this thread, Adam.

It's not too late to save some face by conceding you're initial thoughts were ill-thought-out, though. We've all been there.
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby 'skope » 06 Jun 2015, 22:36

Mabel Griff's Toyshop wrote:
K wrote:Homophobic and racist. You are a piece of work.


It has to be noted, you are not covering yourself in glory on this thread, Adam.

It's not too late to save some face by conceding you're initial thoughts were ill-thought-out, though. We've all been there.


:lol:

fuck off andrew, you fat cunt.

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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby The Modernist » 07 Jun 2015, 10:02

Skope having a different opinion doesn't make him a racist. Get a grip people.

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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Diamond Dog » 07 Jun 2015, 10:30

The Modernist wrote:Skope having a different opinion doesn't make him a racist. Get a grip people.



It does if he is implying that black players don't become manager's because they either don't have the ability or because they are too lazy to apply for positions. Which is exactly what he is implying.

He has had three pages to explain why he believes there is a logical reason, other than racism and prejudice, to explain the huge imbalance between white and non white ex players moving on to managing English clubs.

He has singularly failed to do so - indeed, he has stated that he doesn't have a clue. However, he knows enough, apparently, to know that it categorically isn't because of racism. But refuses to provide any evidence to back even that claim up.

I have provided the very real example of the Rooney Rule in the NFL. Which he chose to completely ignore although it absolutely runs parallel to this particular debate.

Maybe you can do better than him, G, and tell us why you think non white manager's are so seriously disadvantaged/overlooked in the English game?
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby never/ever » 07 Jun 2015, 10:40

I was reminded of this article of 2009... Perhaps the reason is, as stated, the lack of black people in board rooms in general...
http://www.spiked-online.com/newsite/ar ... XQQ0nDXeK0
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Vic Snazell-Sprey » 07 Jun 2015, 10:46

The Modernist wrote:Skope having a different opinion doesn't make him a racist. Get a grip people.


I don't think he's racist, I just think he's clueless. Or stubborn.
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby 'skope » 07 Jun 2015, 10:46

The Modernist wrote:Skope having a different opinion doesn't make him a racist. Get a grip people.


thanks, G. this thread has gone beyond debate and has got unpleasantly personal.

the only fact presented on this thread is that there is a disproportionate number of black managers in the english game. everything else is opinion.

i'm not sure if it's a fact, but it wouldn't surprise me if there is a higher proportion of blacks in football than in most other professions. likewise, i would suggest that the proportion of black players representing the national team is higher than the ratio of the black/white population in England.

let's put some perspective on this debate. football management is the arse-end of the professional game, just below refereeing. it is not some supreme position of power. in someways it's the most thankless job in the game and compared to the wages paid to the top players is also not as financially rewarding either.

i simply don't buy into the argument that owners who spend fortunes in transfer fees and salaries on black players, wouldn't be willing to do the same on black managers due to "overt and covert racism".

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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby Vic Snazell-Sprey » 07 Jun 2015, 11:27

'skope wrote:
The Modernist wrote:Skope having a different opinion doesn't make him a racist. Get a grip people.


thanks, G. this thread has gone beyond debate and has got unpleasantly personal.


'skope wrote:
fuck off andrew, you fat cunt.


:roll:
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Re: FA told Graham Taylor not to pick too many black players for England

Postby 'skope » 07 Jun 2015, 11:28

Mabel Griff's Toyshop wrote:
'skope wrote:
The Modernist wrote:Skope having a different opinion doesn't make him a racist. Get a grip people.


thanks, G. this thread has gone beyond debate and has got unpleasantly personal.


'skope wrote:
fuck off andrew, you fat cunt.


:roll:


just giving you some back, andrew!