The BCB blue-eyed soul thread

[fange]

Wonderful. Never seen that live footage.

[sloopjohnc]

I suppose I've long taken the label to be 'white mimicking black', used pejoratively, as if that matters when it comes to singing with emotion and feeling.

Nevertheless, for me, MacKenzie could be argued to fit this term for this reason and the fact that his influences ranged from Dusty, Nina Simone, Bowie (natch), Ferry, Celtic/British folk music, European torch songs, all adding up to that distinctive 'soulful' delivery that affects and moves.

Sloopjohnc nails it: 'elastic'. Maybe there's a new genre, 'elastic soul'?

I genuinely wanted to hear why you thought so and glad you did.

I tend to think of it as white guys or gals mimics a soul style. Everyone calls Hall & Oates the epitome of blue-eyed soul, but I don't know if Daryl Hall quite has the voice for it. It's a good voice and he mimics some soul stylings, but I don't know if he quite reaches it. They're Philly background gives them a lot of credibility, in my mind.

[Sintek]

What about those who purport to exude 'soul' but in reality resemble wailing moggies struggling to escape the rapids .i.e. Adele? Call it 'Rustic soul', renovated sounds given a a nouveau tech polish, shabby Chic ...

[Jimbo]

I had thought that the blue eyed soul label wouldn't apply to jazz-folky Tim Buckley until I heard this. His last album, it's unlike anything he'd done before and he'd done a lot but here on this under-rated album with his flex-voice he nails the Al Green soul thing like he was a soulster from the get go.

[The Modernist]

I suppose I've long taken the label to be 'white mimicking black', used pejoratively, as if that matters when it comes to singing with emotion and feeling.

Nevertheless, for me, MacKenzie could be argued to fit this term for this reason and the fact that his influences ranged from Dusty, Nina Simone, Bowie (natch), Ferry, Celtic/British folk music, European torch songs, all adding up to that distinctive 'soulful' delivery that affects and moves.

Sloopjohnc nails it: 'elastic'. Maybe there's a new genre, 'elastic soul'?

He was great, but nothing to do with soul as a musical genre as is being discussed here.

[Sintek]

Isn't that a matter of conjecture, taste and opinion?

[sloopjohnc]

I had thought that the blue eyed soul label wouldn't apply to jazz-folky Tim Buckley until I heard this. His last album, it's unlike anything he'd done before and he'd done a lot but here on this under-rated album with his flex-voice he nails the Al Green soul thing like he was a soulster from the get go.

You'd have a slight case with some of the Greetings from LA songs, but Tim Buckley is about as far away from soul as it can get.

[sloopjohnc]

Isn't that a matter of conjecture, taste and opinion?

It is, but my problem with suggesting MacKenzie is, while his voice soars and swoops, not unlike some soul artists, he does it in a more operatic way vs. using gospel as a basis or template. Lots of soul singers go back to their church beginnings in songs, but MacKenzie seemed to be coming from a different place.

I love his voice and I don't think many people would deny that he's a good singer, but he's layering on a different template than soul.

To my ears, anyway.

[Sintek]

Fair dues,, nice summary there, Sloop.

I suppose, and it;s thinking about it NOW, the label/genre/stylistic terminology is elastic and loose anyway, one man's meat etc ...

[The Modernist]

Isn't that a matter of conjecture, taste and opinion?

To a degree, but genre labels need some sort of consensus for them to make sense.

[fange]

If The Righteous Brothers are the gold standard on the pop end (they are), Eddie Hinton is the gold standard on the blues end.

Yeah, good call. This came on the i-pod this morning and hit that spot beautifully...

[fange]

[The Modernist]

I had thought that the blue eyed soul label wouldn't apply to jazz-folky Tim Buckley until I heard this. His last album, it's unlike anything he'd done before and he'd done a lot but here on this under-rated album with his flex-voice he nails the Al Green soul thing like he was a soulster from the get go.

You'd have a slight case with some of the Greetings from LA songs, but Tim Buckley is about as far away from soul as it can get.

The track Jimbo posted is one I've been banging on about for years on here and is from the same period as Greetings From LA. It's absolutely a soul song and Buckley reinvented himself as a soul singer, albeit a pretty unorthodox one.

[sloopjohnc]

If The Righteous Brothers are the gold standard on the pop end (they are), Eddie Hinton is the gold standard on the blues end.

Yeah, good call. This came on the i-pod this morning and hit that spot beautifully...

Eddie Hinton, Dan Penn and the rest of the Muscle Shoals gang - Donald Dunn, Steve Cropper, etc., are almost automatically excluded by association.

I'm kinda kidding, but kinda not. They had soul up the wazoo.

[fange]

And that's a problem how?