Beefheart on German TV.

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Darkness_Fish
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Re: Beefheart on German TV.

Postby Darkness_Fish » 10 Feb 2018, 21:57

To some extent, I agree with G, but I'm coming at it from the other side. I mean, I love Trout Mask Replica, Shiny Beast, etc, but I don't get why so many are willing to accept the oddness of those albums, but wouldn't dream of listening to U.S. Maple or The Lemon Kittens, etc. I know the answer here is going to be the usual "but they're shite lol" that I normally get here, but I'm looking for a deeper answer. If he hadn't started off in the world of faintly stodgy blues rock (yeah, I'm not really a fan of Safe as Milk), I think very few here would accept the off-kilter nature of his odder albums. I don't understand how you can listen and love TMR, but then write off the vast majority of avant-garde/experimental as talentless dribbling. Why does Beefheart get a pass?
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Super-Jank
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Re: Beefheart on German TV.

Postby Super-Jank » 10 Feb 2018, 21:59

‘faintly stodgy blues rock’ - there’s another one!
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Darkness_Fish
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Re: Beefheart on German TV.

Postby Darkness_Fish » 10 Feb 2018, 22:00

Is this Darkness_Fish bingo?
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K
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Re: Beefheart on German TV.

Postby K » 10 Feb 2018, 22:02

Darkness_Fish wrote:To some extent, I agree with G, but I'm coming at it from the other side. I mean, I love Trout Mask Replica, Shiny Beast, etc, but I don't get why so many are willing to accept the oddness of those albums, but wouldn't dream of listening to U.S. Maple or The Lemon Kittens, etc. I know the answer here is going to be the usual "but they're shite lol" that I normally get here, but I'm looking for a deeper answer. If he hadn't started off in the world of faintly stodgy blues rock (yeah, I'm not really a fan of Safe as Milk), I think very few here would accept the off-kilter nature of his odder albums. I don't understand how you can listen and love TMR, but then write off the vast majority of avant-garde/experimental as talentless dribbling. Why does Beefheart get a pass?

Two answers to this.

1. I don't think I or many others here "write off" the vast majority of Avant Garde artists
2. Beefheart is not just an "Avant Garde" artist. On every album he straddles many genres with utter precision. I'm not so sure he has "odder" albums once it clicks.
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jimboo
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Re: Beefheart on German TV.

Postby jimboo » 10 Feb 2018, 23:04

I think the good capt is really quite accessible as has been said once he clicks with you. I take the fishes point.However, I would love others to share my love of the left field of rock , but, while something like parson sound is glorious, I wouldn't bother trying to tell BCB about them.
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Re: Beefheart on German TV.

Postby bobzilla77 » 11 Feb 2018, 03:08

The Modernist wrote:He's the biggest sacred cow around and always has been. I've given up looking for opposing views on him because they're just not out there, not amongst the critical rock establishment anyway. He's the artist who unites the post-punkers and the proggers, more importantly he's become this rite of passage for anyone who considers themselves a serious music fan who wants to dig deeper away from the mainstream. So you get a kind of fait accompli around him, he's immune to the kind of criticism or fashionable revisionism that affect just about any other artist. He's like this article of faith for a certain kind of music fan.


Not everyone can dig it.



There have been other music guys we knew that couldn't stand it. It's sure an acquired taste.

But the people that are convinced of his greatness, will never be convinced otherwise.
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bobzilla77
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Re: Beefheart on German TV.

Postby bobzilla77 » 11 Feb 2018, 03:19

Darkness_Fish wrote:To some extent, I agree with G, but I'm coming at it from the other side. I mean, I love Trout Mask Replica, Shiny Beast, etc, but I don't get why so many are willing to accept the oddness of those albums, but wouldn't dream of listening to U.S. Maple or The Lemon Kittens, etc. I know the answer here is going to be the usual "but they're shite lol" that I normally get here, but I'm looking for a deeper answer. If he hadn't started off in the world of faintly stodgy blues rock (yeah, I'm not really a fan of Safe as Milk), I think very few here would accept the off-kilter nature of his odder albums. I don't understand how you can listen and love TMR, but then write off the vast majority of avant-garde/experimental as talentless dribbling. Why does Beefheart get a pass?



I'm not totally speaking from the point of view you describe, I like Lemon Kittens, Y Pants, Lightning Bolt, Ruins and plenty of other weird arty stuff.

But I would say that Beefheart has more of a connection to traditional American music than most of that stuff. You can hear the blues in it the same way you hear it in Ornette Coleman, howling over a non-linear set of chords. It's not actually blues in formal structure, but the effect is similar. It has that spook, even though the form is different.

And it also rocks, kicks like a mule. A lot of avant bands can get loud, but most of them don't swing with abandon. Beefheart music just has this untamed, wild, naural quality about it where a lot of others come off mannered and deliberate.
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Charlie O.
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Re: Beefheart on German TV.

Postby Charlie O. » 11 Feb 2018, 04:41

bobzilla77 wrote:That version of Steal Softly Thru Snow is killer, and I think I finally understand how to play it after staring at Ed Marimba's left foot for several minutes.

:lol: He isn't playing it just like Drumbo did (I doubt the Captain noticed), but it works, it really swings.

Live Beefheart tends to bug me if only because Don for some reason didn't think it necessary to memorize his own lyrics (let alone vocal phrasing) the way he made his musicians memorize their parts. But Beat Club caught him on a more-than-pretty-good day. He even seems to be enjoying himself.
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