Musical betrayals

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Bride Of Sea Of Tunes
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Re: Musical betrayals

Postby Bride Of Sea Of Tunes » 07 Aug 2017, 18:43

take5_d_shorterer wrote:
Bride Of Sea Of Tunes wrote:

I always wonder about who Tom Waits is - when I play an LP of his.

Sometimes I think: he started out on a real peak, and kept his standards high. He had assumed a certain persona in his early 20s, which is not uncommon in artistry. That of a world-weary, regretful, wizened, urban bohemian (pardon me the clumsy expression). As students we loved this type of music so much.

Did he become the real TW he always had wanted to be in 1983? I think he was no 'impersonator' any more - did he stop playing a role?

Obviously I don't have any clear cut answer to all of this.


The answer that Waits gives (and I have no reason to doubt it) is that the sea-change occurs when he met his wife, Kathleen Brennan, on the film, One From the Heart.

Tom Waits before Brennan sounds very different from after Brennan. He has said that her musical tastes are much more eccentric than his. He's also said that she gave him the confidence to pursue making exactly the music that he wanted to make.

Whatever the causes, it's clear to me that he found a new and different peak when he was 33-34, which is very atypical. Yes, I like early Tom Waits, but there's no comparison to the stuff after Brennan. You get the feeling that he really took charge: Monk, Mingus, sentimental parlor music from 1890, music from Eastern and Central Europe, gamelan music, talking drums, delta blues, church music from the 1850s, the Weimar Republic. None of these was there before Brennan.


Thank you! -

where did you find this information? The Hoskyns book perhaps? I had a period in which I didn't read books on music, don't precisely know why that was. So I missed out on various interesting biographies.

Your explanation sounds completely credible.
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take5_d_shorterer
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Re: Musical betrayals

Postby take5_d_shorterer » 07 Aug 2017, 19:02

http://www.tomwaitsfan.com/tom%20waits% ... ne-gq.html

And yes, it is the same Elizabeth Gilbert who struck gold with her memoir.

I heard about Gilbert not because of her bestseller but because she interviewed Waits. The interview was featured on radiolab at http://www.radiolab.org/story/117294-me ... -and-muse/

There're plenty of other examples of Waits talking about Brennan (and that's coming from someone who doesn't follow Waits minutiae all that closely), and as I've said, the claim seems credible. I have no reason to doubt the chronology and the causation.

Brennan figures prominently in his interviews, but she doesn't appear all that often in public.

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Bride Of Sea Of Tunes
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Re: Musical betrayals

Postby Bride Of Sea Of Tunes » 07 Aug 2017, 19:05

take5_d_shorterer wrote:http://www.tomwaitsfan.com/tom%20waits%20library/www.tomwaitslibrary.com/interviews/02-june-gq.html

And yes, it is the same Elizabeth Gilbert who struck gold with her memoir.

I heard about Gilbert not because of her bestseller but because she interviewed Waits. The interview was featured on radiolab at http://www.radiolab.org/story/117294-me ... -and-muse/

There're plenty of other examples of Waits talking about Brennan (and that's coming from someone who doesn't follow Waits minutiae all that closely), and as I've said, the claim seems credible. I have no reason to doubt the chronology and the causation.

Brennan figures prominently in his interviews, but she doesn't appear all that often in public.


Thanks again, Take5, nice to have these.
The invisible and the non-existing very much look alike.

Six String
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Re: Musical betrayals

Postby Six String » 09 Aug 2017, 05:36

take5_d_shorterer wrote:
Bride Of Sea Of Tunes wrote:

I always wonder about who Tom Waits is - when I play an LP of his.

Sometimes I think: he started out on a real peak, and kept his standards high. He had assumed a certain persona in his early 20s, which is not uncommon in artistry. That of a world-weary, regretful, wizened, urban bohemian (pardon me the clumsy expression). As students we loved this type of music so much.

Did he become the real TW he always had wanted to be in 1983? I think he was no 'impersonator' any more - did he stop playing a role?

Obviously I don't have any clear cut answer to all of this.


The answer that Waits gives (and I have no reason to doubt it) is that the sea-change occurs when he met his wife, Kathleen Brennan, on the film, One From the Heart.

Tom Waits before Brennan sounds very different from after Brennan. He has said that her musical tastes are much more eccentric than his. He's also said that she gave him the confidence to pursue making exactly the music that he wanted to make.

Whatever the causes, it's clear to me that he found a new and different peak when he was 33-34, which is very atypical. Yes, I like early Tom Waits, but there's no comparison to the stuff after Brennan. You get the feeling that he really took charge: Monk, Mingus, sentimental parlor music from 1890, music from Eastern and Central Europe, gamelan music, talking drums, delta blues, church music from the 1850s, the Weimar Republic. None of these was there before Brennan.


This what I learned also from that great bio on Tom by Barney Hoskyns. If he didn't come right out and say it in the book it is the only rational conclusion one could come to after reading it.

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pcqgod
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Re: Musical betrayals

Postby pcqgod » 09 Aug 2017, 20:46

Moleskin wrote:
Quaco wrote:Steve Marriott leaving the Small Faces to form Humble Pie.

Mick Ralphs leaving Mott the Hoople just as they were getting good in order to form Bad Company.

Unfortunate changes in direction or loss of magic of your favorite artists: Let's Dance, Muswell Hillbillies, Atlantic Crossing, and so on.

Which ones still bug you? Which ones did you recover from and/or start to see the artist's point?


You're not having Muswell Hilbillies. That's one of my favourite Kinks albums! It's the string of mid-70s concept records that followed it for me.


Totally agree with this. 'Muswell Hillbillies' deserves a reappraisal. There are just flat good songs on it.
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